One Punch Man: Three Crows AP Upgrade, Lightning Genji profile addition.

[Recon1511]

The Three Crows AP Upgrade:

So when I was looking for scans to fix the scaling for The Three Crows profile I noticed that the crows were in fact damaging a weakened Suiryu to the point he thought he was gonna die. These crows would then go on to be defeated by Lightning Max and Snek.

My suggestion is that the crows and the two heroes downscale from Suiryu 7-C+ AP and Dura to just 7-C (Or an "at most 7-C" rating) since Snek and Max were easily defeated by Suiryu

Edit: The scaling doesn't seem to be valid so the crows will probably go back to being 9-A for beating the Super Fight Martial Artists

Also we should remove the "higher as a collective" part since it straight up makes no sense, fighting together doesn't increase their AP.

Lightning Genji:
I made Lightning Genji's profile on my sandbox, please check it out and let me know if anything needs to be fixed,

Recon1511/sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

Scaling Chains:
Both options present 2 different scaling chains, featless Demon Levels that aren't from the MA would upscale from Snek to 7-C and Demon levels that are from the MA would upscale from Maiko Plasma and Electric Catfish Man (who defeated Genji) to High 7-C

 

[Nullflowerblush]

By the time the Three Crows attacked him, Suiryu was tip-toeing on the line between being able to move and not being able to move with a broken arm and a body too broken to reliably stand.

No.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Scaling Chains:
Both options present 2 different scaling chains, featless Demon Levels that aren't from the MA would upscale from Snek to 7-C

Suggesting HA threat level scaling in this day and age smh

 

[Recon1511]

By the time the Three Crows attacked him, Suiryu was tip-toeing on the line between being able to move and not being able to move with a broken arm and a body too broken to reliably stand.

No.

And? Doesn't change the fact he was still damaged by the crows and shortly after that he could endure a brutal beatdown from Bakuzan so his durability didn't wildly decrease because of it.

Hell he mentions after beating the crows alongside Snek and Max (where he performed a devastating kick to one of the crows) that he can still move and when he was fleeing he still had enough strength to leap above the stadium

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

I'm beginning to think that Genos having difficulty against these cats is a outlier

 

[Nullflowerblush]

Should we downgrade Stinger from Garou's Low 7-B at this point, too?

 

[Recon1511]

I'm beginning to think that Genos having difficulty against these cats is a outlier

Why would it be? The only thing it tells me is that top ranked A Class heroes like Stinger and Genji can kill Demon Level threats if they team up while S Class heroes can deal with them on their own.

Suggesting HA threat level scaling in this day and age smh

Nothing outrageous about Demon level threats scaling above the lowest ranked A Class Hero when the threat level was created especifically because those monsters required the might of several high ranking A class heroes to defeat on the first place.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Why would it be? The only thing it tells me is that top ranked A Class heroes like Stinger and Genji can kill Demon Level threats if they team up while S Class heroes can deal with them on their own.

Nothing outrageous about Demon level threats scaling above the lowest ranked A Class Hero when the threat level was created especifically because those monsters required the might of several high ranking A class heroes to defeat on the first place.

Ok, if we’re doing scaling based on hero ranks then watchdog man 6-C when
jokes aside, hero rankings are even more wildly unreliable than threat levels, and are even said to be unreliable due to certain heroes having good or bad matchups against monsters
the hero association has all the shittiest ranking systems for our purposes, so it’s best to avoid them entirely

 

[TheRustyOne]

Suiryu did take hits from someone who was stronger than Choze right after this. Meaning his own durability cannot be all that low.

Unless we consider this to be an outlier or have reason to believe Suiryu's durability was much lower and Bakuzan was holding back?

Right now this seems to make sense to me. Though I don't agree with using the Hero Association scaling, but right now I know it's currently accepted on profiles.

I'll just save it for another thread and not bog this one down.

Lightning Genji's scaling seems fine, as long as that monster continues to scale to Genos. Which seems alright considering he didn't just one shot it.

 

[Kachon123]

I feel the same way as Rusty

 

[Recon1511]

While I do agree that the hero ratings aren't all that reliable, the fact is that the threat level Demon was created because of the existence of monsters that would take the might of several A Class Heroes to defeat. Snek isn't particularly weak but he is among the lowest ranked A Class heroes (Rank 38 got shit on by the Gorilla monster who was Tiger level) so I don't think its that crazy to say Demon level monsters should scale above him when it comes to AP.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

And I think it’s a blatant violation of the fact that hero rankings mean absolutely nothing for scaling, and hero association threat levels mean nothing for scaling, combining the two changes nothing about anything
hero association threat level indicates absolutely nothing about AP, so we can’t just start jumping to conclusions using “it’s not crazy to say” as the basis for it

 

[Recon1511]

Suiryu did take hits from someone who was stronger than Choze right after this. Meaning his own durability cannot be all that low.

Unless we consider this to be an outlier or have reason to believe Suiryu's durability was much lower and Bakuzan was holding back?

Right now this seems to make sense to me. Though I don't agree with using the Hero Association scaling, but right now I know it's currently accepted on profiles.

I'll just save it for another thread and not bog this one down.

Lightning Genji's scaling seems fine, as long as that monster continues to scale to Genos. Which seems alright considering he didn't just one shot it.

I feel the same way as Rusty

So downscaling the crows to just 7-C or giving them an "At most 7-C" rating would be fine?

 

[TheRustyOne]

Either suggestion is fine for me.

I believe most people would prefer the At most 7-C rating though.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Are we just going to ignore that the snek threat level scaling is just invalid
“Demon levels should be superior to snek in AP” is literally invalid for the same reason “demons should be stronger than tiger levels in AP” is
Hero association threat levels factor not only power, but difficulty to exterminate (which covers a shit ton of other things by itself including speed durability and stamina) and aggressiveness, and even more than that according to the threat levels chapter guy
Hero rankings similarly are based on speed, power, stamina, test scores, and even shit like popularity and kill count
Saying “demon levels should be stronger than snek” is like saying all dragon levels should be faster than Iaian
it’s not reliable, I’m not going to tell you sit here and make assumptions using 2 of the most god awful systems for measuring AP, COMBINED, to make the shittiest scaling chain ever work arbitrarily

I think Saitama’s entire existence should tell you that hero rankings are ridiculously bad, anyways, and there was even a point where darkshine, metal bat, and watchdog man were all extremely low ranked C class heroes

 

[Kachon123]

So downscaling the crows to just 7-C or giving them an "At most 7-C" rating would be fine?

I think At most 7-C works

 

[Recon1511]

Okay so the crows, Snek and Max would be "At most 7-C" downscaling from Suiryu.

Genji would just be High 7-C for damaging Grizzly Nyah and I guess Electric Catfish Man too since he could endure hits from Genji and defeat him.

 

[Recon1511]

Bump

 

[Recon1511]

Bump again

 

[Recon1511]

Bump

 

[Null]

So when I was looking for scans to fix the scaling for The Three Crows profile I noticed that the crows were in fact damaging a weakened Suiryu to the point he thought he was gonna die.

I think Suiryu revealed that if she was going to die because she was also attacked by Goketsu first, The three crows only gave a little damage, but Suiryu was still able to survive and it didn't make her be deadly.

 

[Null]

I think At most 7-C works

It makes more sense if it is rated "Possible 7C" because the three crows only attack when Suiryu's condition is currenly injured.

 

[TheRustyOne]

It makes more sense if it is rated "Possible 7C" because the three crows only attack when Suiryu's condition is currenly injured.

Suiryu was able to take multiple attacks from Bakuzan, who is far stronger than Choze, after the birds already fought him.

So his durability isn't vastly lower, at least not enough to cause doubt on them being 7-C for a possibly rating. For me anyway.

 

[Null]

Suiryu was able to take multiple attacks from Bakuzan, who is far stronger than Choze, after the birds already fought him.

So his durability isn't vastly lower, at least not enough to cause doubt on them being 7-C for a possibly rating. For me anyway.

The Three Crows only cornered Suiryu, the blows were also not too hard to cause fatal injuries, it's not like Goketsu to break armbones & Likewise Bakuzan with crack his backbone

 

[Recon1511]

Not really, the crows were in fact damaging him and making him bleed and Gouketsu fully intended for his disciples to kill and eat Suiryu.

Suiryu being injured and weakened doesn't really factor into this, especially because he would go on to survive a beatdown from Bakuzan shortly afterwards so its clear his durability didn't suddenly massively drop.

 

[Null]

Not really, the crows were in fact damaging him and making him bleed and Gouketsu fully intended for his disciples to kill and eat Suiryu.

Prior to that, Gouketsu had inflicted suiryu it deep lesion, which was why The Three Crows could make him issue splash bleed from his mouth with a punch.

 

[Recon1511]

That's just headcanon and again requires the assumption that Suiryu had a massive drop in durability when he was facing the crows.

 

[Recon1511]

bump

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Rusty makes sense to me.

 

[Recon1511]

Great, I would need one more staff approval and I'll apply these.

 

[Damage3245]

Both options present 2 different scaling chains, featless Demon Levels that aren't from the MA would upscale from Snek to 7-C and Demon levels that are from the MA would upscale from Maiko Plasma and Electric Catfish Man (who defeated Genji) to High 7-C

Why do this?

I don't think featless Demons should be upscaling from Snek. There's just no good reason for it.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

If we allowed hero rank to cross scale with hero association threat levels
we get 7-B zombieman, and deep sea king being strong enough to easily kill the disciples
yeah

 

[Recon1511]

Why do this?

I don't think featless Demons should be upscaling from Snek. There's just no good reason for it.

Fair enough, best wait until the disaster level scaling CRT for that though

That being said, Demon levels from the Monster Association should upscale from Maiko Plasma and Electric Catfish Man since their threat levels are assigned based on AP after a direct evaluation from Gyoro Gyoro.

 

[Null]

That's just headcanon and again requires the assumption that Suiryu had a massive drop in durability when he was facing the crows.

This is based on the fact, that Suiryu has internal injuries, which was previously done by Gouketsu,

this analogy is much like an ordinary person who beats up a person who medium is injured in part his internal organs, and makes him bleed as a result of his internal organs being quite fatally injured.

 

[ByAsura]

I think at most Low 7-C seems reasonable, since they literally had to do at least some level of damage (even if it just expounded on existing injuries).

As for Snek scaling, the strongest A-Class should definitely scale above this since they explicitly have S-Class combat power (I did a translation here), whereas Snek doesn't have that distinction.

I also think that primarily physical/destructive Demon levels (i.e Scaledon or 170,000-Year-Old Cicada Larva) should automatically scale, but not necessarily all of them.

Neutral on Genji.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

I think at most Low 7-C seems reasonable, since they literally had to do at least some level of damage (even if it just expounded on existing injuries).

Agreed

As for Snek scaling, the strongest A-Class should scale above this since they explicitly have S-Class combat power (I did a translation here), whereas Snek doesn't have that distinction.

Scale above what exactly?

 

[ByAsura]

Snek and Lightning Max.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

We should honestly just scale them to prisoner, the weakest S class

 

[ByAsura]

I'm pretty sure S-Class combat power just means capable of handling a Demon level, since Iaian and co have similar statements and that's the prerequisite of becoming S-Class.

 

[Recon1511]

I think at most Low 7-C seems reasonable, since they literally had to do at least some level of damage (even if it just expounded on existing injuries).

As for Snek scaling, the strongest A-Class should definitely scale above this since they explicitly have S-Class combat power (I did a translation here), whereas Snek doesn't have that distinction.

I also think that primarily physical/destructive Demon levels (i.e Scaledon or 170,000-Year-Old Cicada Larva) should automatically scale, but not necessarily all of them.

Neutral on Genji.

The crows, Snek and Max would downscale to Low 7-C then? Consequently those 3 A Classes and Iaian (Pre-MA Arc Key) would scale to that value.