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My Hero Academia: Twin Impact Scaling

TheRustyOne

VS Battles
Calculation Group
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Making a CRT for this, so we can have a proper disucssion.

In My Hero Academia chapter 215, Monoma uses Twin Impact on 8% Izuku, which was strong enough to injure him. Twin Impact is stated allows the users to activate a second attack in a previous place that they've hit. The second impact will have several times more power than their first.

Since Monoma's attack, multiplied by several times, can injure 8% Izuku, who is 8.12 Tons. That means his base AP is several times weaker, which should put him at least 8-C, possibly High 8-C. Since several can mean three times at the least, all the way up to eleven times for the most. Since a dozen is more than several, so it cannot be higher than eleven.

This thread is discuss if this is acceptable, and who scales to this.

JTA Uraraka should scale as she is able injure Monoma and overpower him. Toga during the War Arc would scale, via hurting Uraraka during their fight in the house.

JTA Kendo might scale, as she's usually shown to be able to hurt Monoma and should be physically superior to him with Big Hands. This one is up for discussion.

Edit: Joint Training Arc Base Izuku and Shindo will also be scaling as well.
 
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Only the attack itself can do that not Monoma himself. Why give someone a boost from an attack that can only do it itself? that honestly doesn't make sense

What also wouldnt make sense is that if that attack can hurt 8% Deku, how in the world is Uraraka gonna scale when even Bakugou himself considers Deku a rival? and to go the extra length, everyone considered Deku that biggest threat and wanted him out immediately but had not cared about the others
 
What do you mean?

Monoma's physical attack, multiplied by several times via Twin Impact, can injure 8% Izuku (8.12 Tons). Which means Monoma's physical attack is several times weaker than 8% Izuku's durability.

At the lowest his AP is 8-C (0.73 Tons), at his highest it's High 8-C (2.7 Tons). Since several means more than 2, but is less than a dozen which is 12.

Monoma is at most 3x weaker or at least 11x weaker than 8% Izuku, going by Twin Impact's multiplier.

What is your problem with this, I don't believe I understand what you're saying.
 
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Several means more than 2, but it cannot be 12 since that would be a dozen.

So at least he's 3x weaker, at the most he is 11x weaker.

To be more accurate, several means "More than two, but not many."
 
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What do you mean?

Monoma's physical attack, multiplied by several times via Twin Impact, can injure 8% Izuku (8.12 Tons). Which means Monoma's physical attack is several times weaker than 8% Izuku's durability.

At the lowest his AP is 8-C (0.73 Tons), at his highest it's High 8-C (2.7 Tons). Since several means more than 2, but is less than a dozen which is 12.

Monoma is at most 3x weaker or at least 11x weaker than 8% Izuku, going by Twin Impact's multiplier.

What is your problem with this, I don't believe I understand what you're saying.
Wait. Sorry idk how I missed those parts lol

So did Monoma just slap him right? I thought that quirk didn't work on physical contact
 
This should be fine.
So did Monoma just slap him right? I thought that quirk didn't work on physical contact
Monoma needs to hit Deku in order to later use Twin Impact, if the Quirk could be activated without physical contact it would be broken.

By the way, shouldn't Deku scale as well? He saved Uraraka two times from Shinso, unless there is something that justify she was not in any danger at all.
 
Hm... I guess JTA Base Izuku and Shinso can scale as well, do people agree with that?
 
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From what Therefir said.

Shinso was able to threaten Uraraka (Who scales to Monoma), and Base Izuku protected her. Shinso has to scale to Uraraka in order to threaten her, or his attack would've been ineffective. Someone who is Baseline 9-A cannot harm someone who 8-C, possibly High 8-C.

Basically him being 9-A would've made the scene pointless.
 
It was said the reason why they had to be wary of Shinso was because of his quirk hence why Deku knew he would need to take him on instead
 
I see no reason why they shouldn’t scale.

Unless we’re about to push the narrative that Ochako grew to a level that she can one shot Base Deku and Shinso while they barely got stronger.
 
It was said the reason why they had to be wary of Shinso was because of his quirk hence why Deku knew he would need to take him on instead
No, Shinso attacked Uraraka and Izuku intercepted his attack to protected her. Shinso Quirk is worthless against someone one on one who knows what his Quirk is, Uraraka was not in danger of falling under Brainwashing. If Uraraka could handle Shinso with utter ease, there's no reason for Izuku to protect her from him.

It had nothing to do with his Quirk.
 
Im not understanding. All Deku did was just intercept the attack and then he tried taking him on but all Shinso did was back away together space then tried using debris to attack instead

Have we even see Base Deku land a hit on Shinso? cause I honestly now dont remember
 
It's about intention, if Izuku cannot hurt Shinso then why is he trying to fight him without OFA? He didn't want to use OFA at that moment yet he still wanted to fight up close with Shinso. Izuku and Shinso are still comparable to each other, or their fight is pointless. Since one or the other would've been unable to hurt the other.

He didn't decide to use OFA until Shinso dropped some pipes down on him.

If Uraraka was capable of one shotting and tanking Shinso's attacks, there's no reason for Izuku to protect her.

Narratively, Shinso, Base Izuku, and Uraraka are comparable to each other.
 
It's not rocket science, none of these characters base forms are far off each other.

If it comes to base forms, almost everyone can be scaled to each other.

Like Shinso can be scaled to Aizawa based off their training scenes and narratively, he's still weaker than Aizawa. Toga also scales to Aizawa and she actually used a similar move to Izuku this chapter when Aizawa captured her, to spin mid-air, stab him and escape his scarf. Toga has already fought Ochako twice in hand to hand combat where they are pretty comparable.

With Vigilantes, one can even go ahead and scale Aizawa, Knuckleduster & Stain through their scuffles over there.

More or less the evidence is on most characters base forms being comparable apart from skill level.
 
This is absurd. Not only would this technically be classified as an outlier, given all of the scalings we've established and threads. Monoma targetted Base Deku. Even if the attack was multiplied several times over, this wouldn't allow him to suddenly be able to injure 8% Deku. Need I remind you, Base Deku at this point of time is only 9-A. Uraraka is also rated as a 9-B+ in the Sports Festival. Is she suddenly hundreds of times stronger now?

Unless you're suggesting that Base Deku and Uraraka suddenly went from 9-B+ or 9-A to 8-C in only but a few short months, this would be classified as either an outlier or unusable. And in case you somehow think that Base Deku shouldn't be 9-A, (despite the hundreds of ******* replies showing why that doesn't work in the student thread), I'm willing to explain why you'd be wrong on that too.

Also question; have ever considered the possibility that this might an outlier?
 
Can you provide evidence that Joint Training Arc Monoma being around 3x to 11x weaker than 8% is an outlier?

A high Tier jump does not make an outlier, do not use them going to 9-A to 8-C/High 8-C as an excuse, since that's not what an outlier is. Also, considering that "normal" humans in the MHA world like Jeanist, Endeavor, Shigaraki, and more who don't have durability or strength enhancing Quirks can reach Tier 8 or higher.

"Normal" humans have reach tiers like this before, so it's not absurd for them. Can you provide in universe proof that JTA Monoma can't scale to this?

Edit: Unfortunately I won't be able online for awhile, continue on without me.
 
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A high Tier jump does not make an outlier, do not use them going to 9-A to 8-C/High 8-C as an excuse, since that's not what an outlier is. Also, considering that "normal" humans in the MHA world like Jeanist, Endeavor, Shigaraki, and more who don't have durability or strength enhancing Quirks can reach Tier 8 or higher.
Base Deku was like 9-B+ in the Sports Festival if my memory serves me correctly. Now he's somehow baseline High 8-C? Rusty, that's a 4000 times increase in strength. 4,000 times. This is either a scenario where we ignore facts, logic, and scaling just to upgrade a character on this wiki, or this is an outlier.

Deku would logically be getting tens of times stronger each week if this were the case. Hell, maybe even more. That would surely have a noticeable effect on the story.

Normal humans in the MHA world surely don't obey some of IRL's standards, sure. But for the most part, that really only applies to how powerful, fast, or smart they are. Not how powerful they can get in a short time span. Completely different thing. For Christ's sake, they aren't getting Zenkai Boosts.

"Normal" humans have reach tiers like this before, so it's not absurd for them. Can you provide in universe proof that JTA Monoma can't scale to this?
I'm sorry???

What normal God damn human is able to go from average human levels of strength to peak-human levels of strength in just a few months? With like a decent amount of exercise at best.

There isn't even a God damn training regimen on this planet which would even allow you to grow 4000 times stronger to begin with. If there were, some people's punches would be within the range of hundreds of kilojoules. That is absurd.

Look, I don't mean to sound offensive, but your sentence here doesn't make any sort of sense whatsoever.
 
Actually no, the growth is justified.

Rikido Sato, another character who has shown this level of growth, went from Wall level to Building level+ in the same amount of time. This is because of his Sugar Rush Quirk, which only makes him 5 times stronger. Since the Twin Impact is also a stated multiplier, the same reasoning is being applied in this thread.

Another examples are Tsuyu Asui, Eijiro Kirishima and Mezo Shoji, who went from 9-A to High 8-C in that period of time, and you can't just say these characters were already close to that level, because then that would make characters like Uraraka and Toga scale anyway.

And let's not forget how the durability of many of the students went from Wall level to Large Building level between these sagas.

There is no way we can just ignore all those feats, and call them an outlier, as that would be absurd.
 
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Actually no, the growth is justified.

Rikido Sato, another character who has shown this level of growth, went from Wall level to Building level+ in the same amount of time. This is because of his Sugar Rush Quirk, which only makes him 5 times stronger. Since the Twin Impact is also a stated multiplier, the same reasoning is being applied in this thread.

Another example is Tsuyu Asui and Mezo Shoji, who went from 9-A to High 8-C in that period of time, and you can't justify these characters were already close to that level, because then that would make Uraraka and Toga scale anyway.
There are some exceptions to what I just said, but for the most, this is complete bullshit.
  • Bakugou would be Town level if not higher by the time of the OH raid, according to this logic.
  • Base Deku would also be Town level, given the fourth month time skip of the Endeavor training agency arc. In fact, he might even be higher
Do you want me to bring up every SINGLE character this would apply to? Because I assure you, there are at least several more.

Of course, Sato went from Wall level to Building level+ levels of power in a short amount of time, but that's just a single character. There's an entire cast of characters, who if we apply the same logic to, would all be Town level by the time of the latest arc. Are you gonna sit here and tell me Base Deku should be Town level, along with 80% of the supporting cast?
 
  • Bakugou would be Town level if not higher by the time of the OH raid, according to this logic.
  • Base Deku would also be Town level, given the fourth month time skip of the Endeavor training agency arc. In fact, he might even be higher

Of course, Sato went from Wall level to Building level+ levels of power in a short amount of time, but that's just a single character. There's an entire cast of characters, who if we apply the same logic to, would all be Town level by the time of the latest arc. Are you gonna sit here and tell me Base Deku should be Town level, along with 80% of the supporting cast?
Bakugo and Deku do not have the same level of growth. This was explained by All Might.

All Might to Bakugo: "I get it... This is about Midoriya's incredible growth, right? But... When he starts at level one, and you're at level 50… Naturally, you'll be growing at different rates."

I'm not sure why Sato would be the exception, and not the rule. He doesn't perform any kind of special training as far as we know.

And by the way, if we divided Endeavor's durability by his age, he would reach 1 megaton by the age of 12, how could you justify his current level of power with just a "normal" level of growth? Especially when he implies multiple times he had already reached his limit several years ago, giving up on his dream of surpassing All Might.
 
Bakugo and Deku do not have the same level of growth. This was explained by All Might.

All Might to Bakugo: "I get it... This is about Midoriya's incredible growth, right? But... When he starts at level one, and you're at level 50… Naturally, you'll be growing at different rates."
You took All Might's statement out of context. The reason that All Might said Deku is progressing far faster then Bakugou is because he has One for All. All Might isn't referring to Deku's base form, he's referring to how Deku is developing is fighting style and growing away from his shackles of All Might.

Moreover, this wouldn't refute the other examples of other characters having Town level bases. What is the excuse for Base Deku? Or even other students? No matter how you slice it, my point still stands about how ridiculous this is.

I'm not sure why Sato would be the exception, and not the rule. He doesn't perform any kind of special training as far as we know.
He's an exception because he's only a few people out of dozens of characters who supposedly get thousands of times stronger in only weeks or months. Like I said, is everyone supposed to be Town level by the time the War Arc arrives.

And by the way, if we divided Endeavor's durability by his age, he would reach 1 megaton by the age of 12, how could you justify his current level of power with just a "normal" level of growth? Especially when he implies multiple times he had already reached his limit several years ago, giving up on his dream of surpassing All Might.
Don't what this has to do with anything. I only said it'd be illogical for the student's bases to be thousands of times stronger in only a few short weeks. Endeavor's the Number One hero and has decades of experience with him.

Endeavor is another character who'd be an exception. That doesn't mean you can apply this sort of logic to these student's bases, especially when I've already explained why them getting thousands of times stronger is absolutely ludicrous.

None of what you're arguing explains the ridiculous boost in strength that you believe the students got somehow.
 
Let's bring some numbers into this. If Deku from the Overhaul arc went from Small Building level to Large Building level, that would mean at bare minimum he'd have to get 4000 times stronger.

If we assume the Overhaul arc took place a month before Joint Training (might be even less, but I'm being conservative), this would mean the rest of the students would be getting 133.33 times stronger, each day.

If we account for the fact that Deku and the entire cast trained for four months in their internships, at the end of their internships, they'd be 15999.6 then they were in Joint Training.

If we apply this to Deku's base form, along with anyone who'd theoretically scale to him, (keep in mind, Deku is supposedly baseline Large Building level), this would mean Deku's and his classmate's base forms, in terms of strength, would be 32 Kilotons. Comparable to Town level+.

I'll let that sink in for all of you.
 
You’re arguing out of incredulity, aka not backing any of your beliefs with statements or showings that imply they are correct, just saying “look at this, it makes no sense, it cannot be possible.”

A fictional verse growing in strength by a large amount is not unique to MHA. I see no reason why you are arguing a strength jump is impossible based solely off of numbers. That’s comparable to saying that Iron Man should be downgraded because he could make armor thousands of times stronger than his other armor with no reasoning provided why he could.

Denying blatant scaling due to numbers calculated by the wiki, as if the numbers we found are in anyway fact to the fictional verse, is arrogance. Ochako could literally show up next chapter and swap hands with a High End and you would have to accept that she is as strong as Hood and Endeavor. Attempting to blockade this crt because you can’t handle the idea that characters can grow much stronger over arcs than your calcs imply they could have grown is not valid.
 
Monoma's Twin Impact shot on Deku didn't really do significant damage, and it happened while he was off-guard. I'm not so sure that giving him a litttle nosebleed means that it had to be a Large Building level+ attack.
 
Monoma's Twin Impact shot on Deku didn't really do significant damage, and it happened while he was off-guard. I'm not so sure that giving him a litttle nosebleed means that it had to be a Large Building level+ attack.
People on the wiki have fully scaled to FAR less than giving someone a nosebleed, what? We full scale people off of giving scratches or scuff marks after hitting a person, and Monoma didn’t even punch Deku. He tapped his face. Had he punched him then activated twin impact, the damage would’ve been far more extensive.

This is a strange take.
 
Also, that’s completely ignoring the other part of that scene, where Deku’s eyes go completely white immediately after the impact, showing he was very much hurt by it. Unless his eyes going white was supposed to symbolize nothing?
 
People on the wiki have fully scaled to FAR less than giving someone a nosebleed, what? We full scale people off of giving scratches or scuff marks after hitting a person, and Monoma didn’t even punch Deku. He tapped his face. Had he punched him then activated twin impact, the damage would’ve been far more extensive.

This is a strange take.

I'm just a bit skeptical on Momoma being such a powerful physical fighter based on this when it's an off-guard Deku being hit in the face by an attack he didn't see coming. Causing a nosebleed seems like such a minor injury, like poking someone in the eye.

I'm also fairly sure we avoid scaling people based on something as insignificant as scratch marks unless there's some context I'm missing.

For the attack be comparable to this massive explosion by Bakugo, it seems like there'd need to be a bit more. His eyes going white doesn't necessarily mean he was super hurt by it.

I'm not strongly objecting this; just seems like a wierd method for scaling an otherwise unimpressive fighter.
 
I'm just a bit skeptical on Momoma being such a powerful physical fighter based on this when it's an off-guard Deku being hit in the face by an attack he didn't see coming. Causing a nosebleed seems like such a minor injury, like poking someone in the eye.

I'm also fairly sure we avoid scaling people based on something as insignificant as scratch marks unless there's some context I'm missing.

For the attack be comparable to this massive explosion by Bakugo, it seems like there'd need to be a bit more. His eyes going white doesn't necessarily mean he was super hurt by it.

I'm not strongly objecting this; just seems like a wierd method for scaling an otherwise unimpressive fighter.
Being off guard doesn’t lower durability, and I think you’re underselling how strong you have to be to make someone have an immediate nosebleed with a single swipe on the face.

Also, he’s not a physical fighter. He’s several times weaker than Deku. That’s what the quirk was for. It makes him several times stronger. So he can hurt him at all. And it doesn’t need to be comparable to any attack that has hurt Deku, it just has to hurt him. That’s like saying All Might shouldn’t be hurt by Nomu because Nomu doesn’t destroy a city with every punch.
 
No one is building level in their base form. This why calcing is not always the right way to go. I can't believe stuff is being inflated like this.

Even the strongest physical fighters like quirkless Monoma or Knuckleduster are not building level in their base form let alone Monoma, base Deku or whoever else.

But calcs can be done to force these narratives hence messing up the scaling of the verse.
 
Being off guard can lower durability depending on how the anime wants it to be (which is weird)

my thing about this is how is Uraraka gonna scale when y’all said that if she could take on Shinsou then she would had done so. That doesn’t sound like someone being comparable if they are pretty much told to let someone fight another and still the whole thing about everyone being wary of Shinsou was cause of his quirk because in the end, Deku took down Shinsou using his quirk after all the time. While scale someone who didn’t even have a single feat in his base other then try to take on another? That happens in a lot of anime’s where someone will try to take on another because they feel confident enough and then end up getting destroyed
 
I’m not strongly opposed to this. At this point I don’t really care too much for the scaling here.

However if we’re accepting the characters can get thousands of times stronger in short time frames shouldn’t we split Endeavor into two keys? He goes from standing zero chance against AM and AFO narratively to holding his own against Shigaraki.

Do we apply this same sort of scaling to Deku’s percentages? BoS Deku’s 100%? It has no feats putting it at Small City level until Two heroes which is several months later.

Does that also mean we can accept that 7C Bakugo calc from a while back?
 
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No, Endeavor has never stated to get stronger nor has he been implied to have gotten stronger. His little bout with AFO doesn't prove anything, since neither of them injured each other or did anything. Endeavor reach the peak of his strength years ago, that was the whole reason why he started having kids, since he knew it was impossible for him to be stronger than All Might.

Provide evidence that he's gotten stronger, by either proving he was weaker, or a statement that his strength has increased. (Personally I wouldn't mind if the story reveals he has indeed gotten stronger, that a change of mindset allowed him to reach strength he never could've before, but as of now nothing supports this claim)

Izuku's percentages have nothing to do with this, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

7-C BoS Bakugo is an outlier, not just because of a jump in tier, it's because 7-C is shown to be an outlier for Bakugo. Bakugo has been shown to be inferior to characters who are High 8-C+ and 8-A. BoS Bakugo cannot be stronger than 8%, 20%, and 30% as we know he is inferior to them.

He heavily struggles to perform feats of a lower level. Having a 7-C attack, when his strongest attacks are consistently struggling to reach High 8-C+, is an outlier. We look for what is consistent, and Tier 7 isn't consistent for BoS Bakugo. He is consistently shown to be around High 8-C at the most.

Back to the actual discussion, since that was a little bit of a derailment.

Monoma was able to harm 8% Izuku with an Quirk that increases his attack by several times, which means his normal strength is several times weaker. If someone can bring up a reason for Monoma being 3x to 11x weaker as an outlier, then please provide it. If Monoma was scaling to 8% exactly than yes that'd be an outlier for obvious reasons, but he isn't, he's scaling far below 8% Izuku which is consistent with what we see.

Using anything for the BoS timeline as proof against this is irrelevant, as all of the characters have gotten much stronger by the time of the JTA. If they have stated/implied to have gotten stronger, than a tier jump is fine, as long as it isn't considered inconsistent with their showings.

Monoma, Uraraka, Base Izuku, Shinso, Toga, and Kendo. Have no showings, to my knowledge, that implies they cannot be several times weaker than 8%. With a 3x difference 8% Izuku can easily overpower Shinso, as he was shown to do, with an 11x difference he just stomps them with ease.
 
Monoma was able to harm 8% Izuku with an Quirk that increases his attack by several times, which means his normal strength is several times weaker. If someone can bring up a reason for Monoma being 3x to 11x weaker as an outlier, then please provide it. If Monoma was scaling to 8% exactly than yes that'd be an outlier for obvious reasons, but he isn't, he's scaling far below 8% Izuku which is consistent with what we see.

Okay, I'm fine with it then, unless something inconsistent comes up.
 
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