Lord of the Rings revisions

[Legion350]

Bump

 

[Antvasima]

@Ugarik @Executor_N0 @Therefir @TheRustyOne @DemonGodMitchAubin

We would appreciate your help with calculating this.

 

[Legion350]

Bump

 

[Antvasima]

@Executor_N0 @Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan @Mr._Bambu @Therefir @Ugarik @DMUA @Damage3245 @KGiffoni @TheRustyOne @DemonGodMitchAubin @Jasonsith @Wokistan

We would greatly appreciate your help with calculating the above-mentioned feats.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I can take a look later.

 

[Jasonsith]

Can we even post all the lifting strength, attack potency, speed and hax potency links here forst before we decide who scales to whom?

The links we can find by now:

• Sauron appears to draw in a storm; as he grows aware of Talion's presence, the sky darkens and somewhat severe winds are seen. - 251.67 Megatons of TNT, Mountain level
  Not even a LOTR novel or movie feat I guess
• Osse raises Elenna-nórë - 670 Gigatons. Large Island level+
  (no reasoning why this is performed that the land raises 500 m/s)
• Osse raises Elenna-nórë - My redux - 38.357 teratons TNT (Country level)
  (timeframe to be determined)
• Thangorodrim Pancakes - 7.0392e+18 J (1.6 Gigatons TNT) (Large Mountain level)
• Barad-dur gets screwed - 154,000,000 J (0.03 Tons of TNT) (Small Building level)

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Osee's feat is invalid because TK lifting is not applicable to AP unless instantaneous via new standards

 

[Jasonsith]

Osee's feat is invalid because TK lifting is not applicable to AP unless instantaneous via new standards

Not even when time frame is determined? Like if something is lifted over time or an attack endures over time it has to be divided by the time required to finish? Like if a feat takes two strikes then the energy from one strike is divided by 2; if a lifting feat takes for 60 seconds the AP will be the feat yield divided by 60 etc(?)

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you very much to everybody who are helping out.

 

[InfiniteSped]

• Sauron appears to draw in a storm; as he grows aware of Talion's presence, the sky darkens and somewhat severe winds are seen. - 251.67 Megatons of TNT, Mountain level

We should definitely not use the games for the canon stuff.

• Osse raises Elenna-nórë - 670 Gigatons. Large Island level+
  (no reasoning why this is performed that the land raises 500 m/s)
• Osse raises Elenna-nórë - My redux - 38.357 teratons TNT (Country level

If lifting doesn't work for AP, these can only be used for the lifting strength itself, maybe.

• Barad-dur gets screwed - 154,000,000 J (0.03 Tons of TNT) (Small Building level)

That's from the movies, which aren't canon either, so wouldn't quite work.

We have the Ancalagon feat, which is hard to scale reliably since he barely appears at all. Besides that, the Galadriel feat seems too vague to calc, along with Gandalf and the Balrog.

I think there was a 7-C calc for Smaug, but I'm not sure if he can be scaled to the Maiar.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Not even when time frame is determined? Like if something is lifted over time or an attack endures over time it has to be divided by the time required to finish? Like if a feat takes two strikes then the energy from one strike is divided by 2; if a lifting feat takes for 60 seconds the AP will be the feat yield divided by 60 etc(?)

Not sure, if I recall correctly I think it's something about the set of muscles involved but you can ask DontTalkDT to be sure.

 

[InfiniteSped]

I mean, did he physically grab the island and push it upwards, or just did it with magic? I don't think muscle physics would matter much here.

 

[Jasonsith]

Not sure, if I recall correctly I think it's something about the set of muscles involved but you can ask DontTalkDT to be sure.

I remember a time when crushing boulders (not lifting it, sliding it or rolling it) can translate into AP as well as lifting strength.

It may actually sound reasonable lifting an island over time does not mean a character has the attack potency yield directly represented by the aggregate yield of the island lifting feat, but time factor should reasonably come into consideration, like if a feat is taken over time, then the yield lifting feat over time, if other criteria are meet, should be considered as an indicator of attack potency.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that Jason makes sense, but am not the right person to ask.

 

[Antvasima]

I remember a time when crushing boulders (not lifting it, sliding it or rolling it) can translate into AP as well as lifting strength.

It may actually sound reasonable lifting an island over time does not mean a character has the attack potency yield directly represented by the aggregate yield of the island lifting feat, but time factor should reasonably come into consideration, like if a feat is taken over time, then the yield lifting feat over time, if other criteria are meet, should be considered as an indicator of attack potency.

@DontTalkDT

We would appreciate your input here.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

bump

 

[Antvasima]

@DontTalkDT @Goodyfresh @Colonel_Krukov @Newendigo @Legion350 @Edenstar @InfiniteSped @GojiBoyForever

Your help would be appreciated here.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Moving on for now from the Osse feat, the next useful feats would probably be the Balrog "breaking the mountainside", and the 7-C Smaug feats?

 

[Legion350]

There is also Sauron causing Mount Doom to erupt.

 

[Jasonsith]

There is also Sauron causing Mount Doom to erupt.

Can Mount Doom be measured (esp. the mouth?)

Can it be proxied by any real life volcano? Say Mount Ngauruhoe, which was used as a stand-in for the fictional Mount Doom in Peter Jackson's The Lord of the Rings film trilogy?

 

[Legion350]

Okay, so after doing some digging I found this quote about Mount Doom's size.

Sam saw now that it was less lofty than the high passes of the Ephel Dúath which he and Frodo had scaled. The confused and tumbled shoulders of its great base rose for maybe three thousand feet above the plain, and above them was reared half as high again its tall central cone, like a vast oast or chimney capped with a jagged crater.

There was a map I saw based on this quote, but I can’t add images rn it seems.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you very much for the help.

Is somebody willing to calculate that please?

 

[Jasonsith]

Can Mount Doom be measured (esp. the mouth?)

Can it be proxied by any real life volcano? Say Mount Ngauruhoe, which was used as a stand-in for the fictional Mount Doom in Peter Jackson's The Lord of the Rings film trilogy?

I have a picture of the mountain itself and a picture of the volcano crater (which should also indicate the radius of the volcano mouth). But how should one determine the height of the mountain?

Say, if a mountain is said to have an elevation of 2,291 m, is that a height relevant to the neighbouring land? If yes, maybe I can work out the calculation really soon.

 

[InfiniteSped]

The movies aren't part of the main canon, so I don't think it really matters what they used there. Better to find whatever metrics the books used, and also the specific quote of Sauron causing it to erupt.

 

[Legion350]

Turgon followed Túrin, but of his time it is chiefly remembered that two years ere his death, Sauron arose again, and declared himself openly; and he re-entered Mordor long prepared for him. Then Barad-dûr was raised once more, and Mount Doom burst into flame

Here’s a quote talking about its eruption.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think the 2,291 meters refers to the elevation above sea level iirc. But in some random article I found mentions it being 3000 feet above surrounding land. But unsure the reliability or safety of that link. But Prominence is the word used for height relative to surrounding land.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Alright, I found a more secure source this time; the exact height of the mountain is more like 967 meters.

 

[Jasonsith]

I think the 2,291 meters refers to the elevation above sea level iirc. But in some random article I found mentions it being 3000 feet above surrounding land. But unsure the reliability or safety of that link. But Prominence is the word used for height relative to surrounding land.

Good I have a clean prominence figure out of mount Ngauruhoe. "Just" 967 m and am ninja'd by DDM. Now I can do one leave outside the rules (LOTR) assorted feats calc blog.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you to everybody who are helping out.

 

[Jasonsith]

Done

Pick your favourite end. (If we use the highballed benchmark, we actually have a multi continent LOTR)

Also, suggest more feats to be calculated.

 

[Antvasima]

Done

Pick your favourite end. (If we use the highballed benchmark, we actually have a multi continent LOTR)

Also, suggest more feats to be calculated.

Thank you very much for helping out so much Jason.

@Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan

Would you be willing to evaluate this and then tell us here please?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Wow, that would be impressive, I'll take a look.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Is it fine to use movies to supplement information for novel feats?

 

[InfiniteSped]

They were made decades after Tolkien's death, and had no involvement from his estate, iirc, he just sold the rights before his death.

As good as they are, they're basically fan-fic in regards to the actual canon.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that we may not have any better available option than to use this type of approximation in this case.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Mount Doom is still implied to be an absurdly massive Volcano, so some would see it as a lowball if anything.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, that is a very good point.

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Would it scale to Sauron's 6-B key?

 

[Jasonsith]

Is it fine to use movies to supplement information for novel feats?

Did the novel mention descriptions of the feat contradictory against the movie feat portrayal? If yes, then the novel feat description should prevail.

Would it scale to Sauron's 6-B key?

Actually, yes. (If High 6-A is too much.) Since this is the final AP feat carrying energy released as Sauron disappeared from the human world realm.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you to everybody who are helping out here.