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Let's ensure that characters know who they are fighting by SBA

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Well, some people had complaints about 4 kilometers being the general starting distance if at least one character is a long range fighter. Since most characters popular in Vs threads happen to prefer close quarters regardless of having great range. First person shooter protagonists are among the few non telepathic characters who actually would make use of the 4 kilometer starting range from the get go.

Whether characters actually use their hax, abilities, or superior physical stats in character is a different story, but AKM Sama is basically saying that SBA shouldn't be making most powers and abilities pointless to have. If we have close starting range, having a long ranged sniper rifle and/or enhanced senses, or stealth mastery is fairly pointless. Just stating some alternative, not trying to overthink it. But admittedly I do sound like I am writing like this.
 
Anti-Spiral also made a sandwich out of galaxies to wrestle TTGL.
 
I feel like it’s easier to say ‘they know who they’re fighting, but don’t have prior knowledge.’ Help isn’t even allowed, by SBA standards the battlefield shouldn’t have anyone else in it unless the OP states it.
This is also a good point that I think should be clarified.

Why on would anything else besides the given participants be in the battlefield?
 
This is also a good point that I think should be clarified.

Why on would anything else besides the given participants be in the battlefield?
And people, animals and plants should be around for people with the ability to manipulate those to control. That's part of the intention behind choosing Central Park, that most of the common stuff you would have around to control happens to be available.

And of course, the ability to blend into a crowd is relevant for assassins. If you're the only human around disguising yourself would do nothing.
 
Missed this. But I kinda disagree there.

Wouldn’t characters who’s abilities rely on other civilians be a form of outside assistance? And as for the stealth point, assassins don’t necessarily need bystanders specifically to blend in and use their stealth skills. The general surroundings (like forests, mountains, vast infrastructures, buildings, etc.) can do the same thing without needing other living people around on the battlefield. Which ofc is a case by case basis thing for battlefields since fighting in abandoned places is also entirely possible for a vs fight scenario.
 
Missed this. But I kinda disagree there.

Wouldn’t characters who’s abilities rely on other civilians be a form of outside assistance? And as for the stealth point, assassins don’t necessarily need bystanders specifically to blend in and use their stealth skills. The general surroundings (like forests, mountains, vast infrastructures, buildings, etc.) can do the same thing without needing other living people around on the battlefield. Which ofc is a case by case basis thing for battlefields since fighting I’m abandoned places is also entirely possible for a vs fight scenario.
A disguise is a specific kind of stealth. Not everyone with disguise skills (best example shapeshifting) is suited for stealth in a forest.
And no, it isn't outside influence unless you consider animals, plants, bacteria and summoned beings outside influence as well. They will never influence the battle on their own accord, but the moment you manipulate them into doing something it's fine.

We are getting really off-topic here, though.
 
We’re not, though. We’re countering your arguments for changing the SBA. You’re bringing them up, and we‘re knocking them down. And it is outside interference- there are people who shouldn’t be there that are influencing the match. Someone with Mind Control powers can easily manipulate the enemy, they don’t need civilians around that aren’t going to contribute unless these are 10-B characters.
 
So what are the conclusions so far here, and would it be a good idea to call more staff members here?
 
We’re not, though. We’re countering your arguments for changing the SBA. You’re bringing them up, and we‘re knocking them down. And it is outside interference- there are people who shouldn’t be there that are influencing the match. Someone with Mind Control powers can easily manipulate the enemy, they don’t need civilians around that aren’t going to contribute unless these are 10-B characters.
By current standards the SBA don't specify that there are no people around, therefore the environment is the way it would usually be. Removing things from Central Park (or the entire planet even) that would usually be there is in fact a change to the SBA. I should know it considering that I wrote the page.

Thinking that the outside influence rules prevents people being present is a misinterpretation on your part. It specifies how living beings brought in as consequence of an ability are allowed.

So yeah, you are suggesting a change to the SBA. We can have a thread about that, but for the time being I would much prefer finishing this one, as the matter doesn't influence the topic of giving the participants of the battle knowledge of who they are fighting.

So what are the conclusions so far here, and would it be a good idea to call more staff members here?
I think "The characters know the direction their opponent(s) start in. Furthermore, they get knowledge of the character's appearance, equivalent to the knowledge they could have gained if they would have been allowed to briefly observe the form opponent(s) starting in using their senses of sight, hearing, smell, taste and touch. It's assumed that they only get the information necessary to identify the opponent(s), so abilities like Information Analysis can not be used based on this knowledge. Negative effects of the observation, such as those caused by Madness Manipulation Type 3, are assumed to not apply for this knowledge either."

Is currently the most accepted formulation, I believe.

One good alternative might be:
"The characters know the direction their opponent(s) start in. Furthermore, they get a description detailed enough to recognize the character in their starting form upon perceiving them. It's assumed that they only get the information necessary to identify the opponent(s), so none of their abilities may activate based on their description. Likewise, all negative effects of being given this knowledge don't apply until they get it again within the battle itself."
Based on what Firephoenixearl suggested.

I don't know who of the staff members would be best suited to ask on this. Since the text went through some revision since the last input, it might indeed be good to ask for some more opinions, though.
 
Okay. Feel free to check through the VS Battles Staff page, and contact the members you think are appropriate with the @Username command.
 
I am fine with the reworked versions; I think the first version works better, from its descriptions.
 
Okay. This seems to have been accepted then.
 
The first proposed version seems to be accepted then. I will apply it shortly.
Actually since Agnaa brought up my old question. @DontTalkDT do you think the characters start within line of sight?
As it currently stands no. That's simply the consequence of taking the starting area as is. No way you would get that much line of sight in Central Park. 4km line of sight would be pretty unusual for basically any non-elevated place on earth tbh.
 
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