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Hakai

TOAAPRESENCE1

TOAAPRESENCE1

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So my question is simple i have seen some people on other threads say that hakai is not limited by those stronger than the user so in other words the gods being able to hakai people stronger than themself and i see other say that the gods cant hakai people stronger than them and use zeno as an example that if they could hakai people stronger they would not be scared of him so my question is

Can they hakai people stronger or no?
 
It's Unknown as far as I can tell. They never stated Zeno was to strong for it to work. For example, all Gods of Destruction are Low 2-C but Goku and Freeza survived Hakai/Destruction Energy from Sidra. If power was a factor, Goku and Freeza who were 3-A at the time would have been erased on the spot but they didn't so power is proven a non issue.
 
Well, then Arceus stomps Beerus. Then again, some people believe Beerus is physically superior to Beerus, but oh well.

Circular scaling at its finest.
 
Well, then Arceus stomps Beerus. Then again, some people believe Beerus is physically superior to Beerus, but oh well.

Circular scaling at its finest.

What do you mean?
 
You said that "Beerus is physically superior to Beerus", which means Beerus scales above himself, which is circular scaling.
 
Ionliosite said:
You said that "Beerus is physically superior to Beerus", which means Beerus scales above himself, which is circular scaling.
Click to expand...
Lol.

But what I mean essentially is that since stronger beings can resist Hakai, Arceus would stomp since I buy Multiversal-Multiversal+ Arceus. However, I know a few people who don't buy said scaling, and only see him and Universal+-Low Multiversal, and that Beerus is physically superior to him via that.

Regardless, Arceus still stomps imo.
 
I do not remember Hakai not working in beings stronger than the user; although is possible that Hakai is just as strong as the user is, and Erasure is just a secondary effect.
 
Arceus resists Existence Erasure and has Abstract Existence Type 1 which none in DB has the NPI to deal with.
 
Hakai not working on stronger opponents has never been a thing supported by canon.

If we take implied evidence then by all means, Goku as of Goku Black Saga should be Low 2-C since he thought he could've done something to Infinite Zamasu if he had a Senzu Bean but we don't, he's still only 3-A during that era.

So either Hakai doesn't work on beings stronger than it and Goku is Low 2-C as of Goku Black Saga or Hakai DOES work on beings stronger than it and Goku is 3-A as of Goku Black Saga.
 
if hakai can work on people stronger what would the limit? someone that could one shot or something like that?
 
If it does work on stronger people then anything below Low 1-C that isn't abstract, doesn't resist EE and isn't too big would be affected by Hakai.
 
....Tbh, I have no idea how that would go and do not want to jump down that rabbt-hole.
 
thats how it is in DB to be honest. its not something that we decide. If someone one in dragon ball were to be hakaid by beerus, and they were stronger, it wont work. Tho instead it is the character that is given EE resistance in this wiki, which i agree it is the best solution, to give beerus the benefit of the doubt.

and no, hakai wont work on zeno. It has been stated many times nothing is capable of taking him out.
 
Nitro90 said:
The only hax in Dragon Ball that irc stated and show not to work on stronger characters is Hit's Time-Skip.
Click to expand...
I really hate how weak in hax dragon ball is. Dio is tier 8, yet he stops time for 8 seconds. While a tier 3 hit can stop time for 0.1 seconds only.

It seems akira wants no improvement for his verse power wise.
 
It's almost as if focusing on your established brand of story-telling takes precedence over hax....
 
Planck69 said:
It's almost as if focusing on your established brand of story-telling takes precedence over hax....
Click to expand...
I mean, akira had plenty of opportunities to make dragon ball a op verse. Yet he doesn't. i wonder why?
 
> to make dragon ball a op verse

Wot, it's filled with mftl universe busters, a entire group of universe Buster's that pull hax out their ass and a new power each time you see em and a character with low multiversal EE. Dragon Ball is op as ****, it not being the most powerful thing ever doesn't change the fact it soloes 99% of verses. And that's without going into Xeno territory.
 
Probably because writing a good story takes precedence over "muh char is bestest and stronkest evah!". There's no necessity for an an author to make a verse OP when he's doing just fine telling a story without that.
 
Planck69 said:
It's almost as if focusing on your established brand of story-telling takes precedence over hax....
Click to expand...
Eh. At the beginning skill mattered a lot at least. Now even the skill transformation that let's you dodge everything also happens to make you so much faster that the instinctive reaction is an afterthought.
 
@Ricsi

My main problem is how people seem to think hax or making an OP verse is everything when it comes to writing.
 
Chariot190 said:
> to make dragon ball a op verse
Wot, it's filled with mftl universe busters, a entire group of universe Buster's that pull hax out their ass and a new power each time you see em and a character with low multiversal EE. Dragon Ball is op as ****, it not being the most powerful thing ever doesn't change the fact it soloes 99% of verses. And that's without going into Xeno territory.
Click to expand...
5-B onwards soloes 99% of fiction....
 
Ultra instinct issei said:
Yet goku was hurt by a bullet, beerus can't kill immortals, their feats are getting inconsistent, ...
Click to expand...
Outliers exist, although in Goku's case it's because he can fluctuate his power to insane degrees. His base everyday casual strength isn't the same as him actually fighting or powered up. Although some things are inconsistent, the TOP arc got kinda messy.
 
Super was mostly an example, I was talking more in general. Now granted its story might not be the best but really, a writer shouldn't just make a verse OP for OP's sake.
 
Also yeah OP for OPs sake is dumb. Avatar is tier 9-7. And it's the greatest animated work ever. Its main competition is FMA, another tier 9-7 verse.
 
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