• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact AKM sama if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.

Gravity Falls/Bill Cipher CRT: Suspension of disbelief dies

Status
Not open for further replies.

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883

Imagine I post everything in that blog in this CRT here, there.

What's gained from it?:
  • Better Size Manip, Body Control and Reality Warping.
  • ", up to Multi-Solar System level physically via Size Manipulation & Realitty Warping (Shown that Ford with his powers could use them to grow larger than a galaxy in length while being smaller in width and seemingly remaining the normal speed of his moments when seen in a third-person perpective)" in his AP and what should go in other stats.
  • ", up to Massibly FTL+ physically via Size Manipulation & Realitty Warping (Shown that Bill could use his powers to grow around Earth's size and quickly travel interplanetary distances, while Ford with his powers could grow around the size of a galaxy while seemingly remaining the normal speed of his moments when seen in a third-person perpective)"
  • The rest is already used by the profile because we are inconsistent on what we say no to.
On the same line of Bill not lying as much as it was believed, this should be readded to his profile.
 

The_Wright_Way

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
15,431
7,585
The only thing I disagree with is Bill missing his home dimension, as that just flat out doesn't track with what what we see about him in the show. This is the guy who vaporized Time Baby when it was pointed out that he was going to destroy the universe. The only reason he keeps his "friends" around is that they're willing to opperate on his terms, as he has no problem threatening them when frustrated and shows no concern for their welfare when Shackletron beats them down. Only exasperation. After all, when Stanford didn't agree to his terms, he immediately tried to torture him and kill his loved ones as a plan B and C respectively. Bill has always read to me as a textbook Complete Monster through and through.

That said, he doesn't lie while making deals. He's very much a Literal Genie about them who exploits technicalities and loopholes, but he doesn't lie. He keeps his word, just in the worst possible way, and he's more than willing to let "freaks" like Stanford join him if they're willing to play ball. So, I agree with the actual upgrades, just not with any sympathetic reading of Bill's character.

Also, I despise describing characters like Bill as "insane" given how far off that is from actual mental health, but that's a personal niggle that doesn't really change anything presented here.
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
The only thing I disagree with is Bill missing his home dimension, as that just flat out doesn't track with what what we see about him in the show.

Having no redeeming qualities in the show/most well-known canon but showing one in other media over something alluded in the show and with a proven denial from his part about how he feels about it makes perfect sense to me. The show planted the seeds for that to happen, it having instead been shown in the show kinda throws Bill down a bit as a villain and the other media showing that feels like a reward from carying to read it. I believe I put in the blog that either he lies about this because that's what he wants to say to others or because he's delusional, but "Says he's happy. He's a liar." to me personally clearly means that he believes his own lie there.

There's also some other Neutral Evil bit from his part in the show; what he was going to do to the universe is again seen as freeing it and its rules and laws as "PERVERSIONS AGAINST ALL WILL", that being the reason as to why he wants to rewrite the system. He's not lying, if this optimum state for a dimension leads to it being destroyed then so be it, to him it's worth it being freed. He destroyed his dimension, which is bad, but he at least freed it, which "needs to happen" for him, which in turn leaves room for regret. But that regret doesn't stop him, which reinforces his evil.
just not with any sympathetic reading of Bill's character.
I mean, in the sense of we feeling sympathetic towards him then I can feel that over any Pure Evil character due to them never doing good while still being living beings. More easily so if they're insane and too out of themselves to think they maybe would if they were sane.

Bill has a document of evil aspects which so happen to have some hidden, small humanization. Being sympathetic over that depends on how willing one is to be sympathetic.
 
12,522
7,087

Imagine I post everything in that blog in this CRT here, there.

What's gained from it?:
  • Better Size Manip, Body Control and Reality Warping.
  • ", up to Multi-Solar System level physically via Size Manipulation & Realitty Warping (Shown that Ford with his powers could use them to grow larger than a galaxy in length while being smaller in width and seemingly remaining the normal speed of his moments when seen in a third-person perpective)" in his AP and what should go in other stats.
  • ", up to Massibly FTL+ physically via Size Manipulation & Realitty Warping (Shown that Bill could use his powers to grow around Earth's size and quickly travel interplanetary distances, while Ford with his powers could grow around the size of a galaxy while seemingly remaining the normal speed of his moments when seen in a third-person perpective)"
  • The rest is already used by the profile because we are inconsistent on what we say no to.
On the same line of Bill not lying as much as it was believed, this should be readded to his profile.
Yeah I agree with this, pretty good bloog by the way, also, shouldnt the 4-A be 3-C? Anyways, if it isnt 3-C, it should be rlly far into 4-A
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
Any 4-A attack that would put a notable hole in a galaxy would put a notable hole in that giant Ford, and no attack Ford could do would destroy a whole galaxy, just an inconsistent fraction depending how he attacked.

You could argue 3-C durability via sheer size but by that logic humans should have 9-A durability via their bodies technically surviving certain Fatalities from Mortal Kombat while they still die.

And before it's asked, no Bill's other abilities aren't acounted for. When tiny he can shoot some energy beam many times bigger than his body but when having already used his power in the biggest scale shown to make himself that big, we don't know if he would still be able to shoot energy proportionally as big as he did before. That would be like claiming that that planet-sized Calypso should still be able to create storms or whatever on a cosmic size and should be given a tier for it.
 
7,122
1,748
I agree with this.

The only reason this wasn't accepted previously is because of the misconception that Bill is lying, except he doesn't lie, and the examples for why are explained very well above
 
13,822
6,957
So... what are Bill's stats with average powers? I recall him leveling a forest at some point which is 7-C from memory

By the way I do agree with this
 
130
39
I'm a bit iffy with the Massively FTL+ speed since we only see him preform this feat in his monologue that he created, so I feel like it should at least be Possibly instead of just flat out Massively FTL+. Other than that, I don't really have any issues with this.
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
I'm a bit iffy with the Massively FTL+ speed since we only see him preform this feat in his monologue that he created, so I feel like it should at least be Possibly instead of just flat out Massively FTL+. Other than that, I don't really have any issues with this.
I have no idea what are you're agreeing with then, nor what logic are you using. It's on a monologue=it's less valid somehow? So when people show they're going to do something if at one point they monologue then that part is less legit? I genuinely don't understand from where you're coming from.
 

Elizhaa

Close enough to enzyme-linked immunoassay acronym!
VS Battles
Sysop
13,578
4,292
The proposed changes seem fine, from what I read.
 
130
39
I have no idea what are you're agreeing with then, nor what logic are you using. It's on a monologue=it's less valid somehow? So when people show they're going to do something if at one point they monologue then that part is less legit? I genuinely don't understand from where you're coming from.
I'm ok with the MSS stuff is because of Bill trying to bargain with Stanley before he dies as I do believe he literally had no reason to lie (I'm saying this in case that was what you were implying with the you having no idea what I'm agreeing with). The reason why I'm iffy about the speed isn't because it's just a monologue, it's because Bill created a hologram type thing (idk what to call it and feel like calling it a hologram is wrong). The issue is that he didn't do the feat himself, it's speculative at best. It's like if I made a hologram thing like Bill's where I destroyed a universe and going faster than light.
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
I'm ok with the MSS stuff is because of Bill trying to bargain with Stanley before he dies
Before Ford dies you mean? Why would he die? And why does it matter at all that anyone dies?
The reason why I'm iffy about the speed isn't because it's just a monologue, it's because Bill created a hologram type thing (idk what to call it and feel like calling it a hologram is wrong). The issue is that he didn't do the feat himself, it's speculative at best. It's like if I made a hologram thing like Bill's where I destroyed a universe and going faster than light.
Then you are severely mistaken. One not doing a feat doesn't inhereditary mean stats from it proven aren't legit, therefore that bit is wrong from your part, there're plenty of cases when that's the case and this is one of them. "Speculative" would be "we actually making real speculations and theories to add new things in the profiles based on info that isn't in the show", this is not the case, this is in the show. The "at best" next to it there really to me seems like some baseless, non rational jab to the feat given only to make what you say look better, as if coming out of sheer personal bias.

Given that, how you weren't able to tell at first why did you even disagree with this while still disagreeing, and how I consider this arguments, I'll ask you to please reconsider to think this through again in the most logical way possible. What would even make the feat go from "Speculative at best" to just "Speculative" and what would make it go from "Speculative" to "Real? Do they need to say magic words like "This is what would happen w/o the barrier"? How is what we already have not enough already for you? It all seems extremely illogical.
 
130
39
Before Ford dies you mean? Why would he die? And why does it matter at all that anyone dies?
I meant Bill (I am planning on trying to explain my points better (since I do kinda struggle with explaining things), just wanted to clear this up first)
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
Idk what makes you believe he's going to die, or how would that affect the sheer veracity of something unrelated he was talking about.
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
I get it now, I got the wrong Stan. But that consistency in what Bill can do isn't what makes his previous word and the visuals he showed true, it was clearly already true when first shown because disbelieving it has the burden of proof.
 

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
Everything done, this was a clean thread.

Edit: I linked the blog rather than the video in youtube because you never know in which parts of the world it may not work, and I had a transcript of the part that matters. Other option is to move it at Imgur, I was lazy there but anyone can do it.
 
Last edited:

Eficiente

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
13,300
2,883
This thread can be closed after Bill's profile is locked, but if anyone wants to make a CRT to add the calc of Bill's laser "in base" then I'll comment on top this thread to link that thread.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top