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Dragon Ball - Gohan's High 4-C upgrade

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Buu Saga Goku and Vegeta are both High 4-C in their base forms by virtue of scaling above the Supreme Kai. Buu Saga Gohan should be given the same treatment; consequently, Cell Games Gohan and likely Goku would be upgraded, too.

Based on his own feats and statements...

Based on powerscaling...
The scaling chain goes as follows...
  • (Cell Games) Heavily Suppressed SSJ Gohan >>> 100% SSJ Goku > 50% SSJ Goku >>>>>> Super Trunks > DBZ 193 Perfect Cell >> "Warm-up" Perfect Cell >>>>>> Super Vegeta >>> SSJ Vegeta and Trunks > Semi-Perfect Cell = High 4-C
    • The gap between a heavily suppressed SSJ Gohan and Semi-Perfect Cell is large enough for even his base form to be comparable to Cell, taking into account the meager multiplier of Super Saiyan
  • (Buu Saga) Vegeta > Gohan >>> Yakon and Pui-Pui > Shin
also, about that yakon one, gohan knows that yakon can absorb auras now, so he was likely suggesting that he and goku take yakon on while suppressed as not to have their ki leak out of their body and get absorbed

So yeah.

Now, if you excuse me, The Breakers' open beta has already begun.
 
That was a lot but it makes sense to me and enjoy the breakers open beta, I've gotta play it myself
 
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That said, wouldn't that scale to Goku too? While Goku is not as powerful as Gohan or Cell, he was still powerful enough to impress Cell and make him enjoy the battle and give him a good match

Cell was also not impressed with Trunks' power even when it surpassed his held back power by a wide margin
 
That said, wouldn't that scale to Goku too? While Goku is not as powerful as Gohan or Cell, he was still powerful enough to impress Cell and make him enjoy the battle and give him a good match

Cell was also not impressed with Trunks' power even when it surpassed his held back power by a wide margin
That's true but I don't think this makes goku high 4C in base during the cell saga
 
That's true but I don't think this makes goku high 4C in base during the cell saga
He should by downscaling from Gohan, as the gap between them isn't massive. Especially when the gap between Base Gohan to Pui-Pui is very wide by scaling to Vegeta who one shotted Pui-Pui, who is stronger than Shin.

Vegeta (and Gohan by scaling) also considered Pui-Pui to be a worthless opponent and Vegeta never poered up from his casual state during the fight, while Cell had to power up and viewed Goku as someone who can give him a good battle despite being weaker. Given Gohan was weaker than Cell, the gap between Goku and Gohan isn't as big as that between Gohan and Pui-Pui, and considering Gohan's power in the Buu Saga is = Cell Games Gohan, the scaling is valid
 
He should by downscaling from Gohan, as the gap between them isn't massive. Especially when the gap between Base Gohan to Pui-Pui is very wide by scaling to Vegeta who one shotted Pui-Pui, who is stronger than Shin.

Vegeta (and Gohan by scaling) also considered Pui-Pui to be a worthless opponent and Vegeta never poered up from his casual state during the fight, while Cell had to power up and viewed Goku as someone who can give him a good battle despite being weaker. Given Gohan was weaker than Cell, the gap between Goku and Gohan isn't as big as that between Gohan and Pui-Pui, and considering Gohan's power in the Buu Saga is = Cell Games Gohan, the scaling is valid
The gap between goku and gohan actually is massive and the wiki already accepts it as such

But if you think goku downscales then sure i guess
 
The gap between goku and gohan actually is massive and the wiki already accepts it as such
It's actually not that massive considering Cell was still impressed with Goku's power. And Gohan isn't as powerful as Cell, even when he held back against him

Regardless, the gap is still smaller than the gap between Vegeta and Gohan to Pui-Pui and Yakon, meaning Goku will still scale
 
Gohan was afraid that goten will surpass his power and he gave him some trouble when they were training

But there's an issue with goten scaling
It's that piccolo (who's weaker than shin) is confirmed to be stronger than base goten

So that'd cause circular scaling
 
That simply meant Goten was a lot stronger than Gohan was when he was his age. Gohan was 9 (And 10 physically, but 9 according to his living world birth record when he became SSJ2) when he first became a SSJ while Goten is only 7. And having potential to surpass Gohan doesn't quite mean he was that close. Though he'd be At least 4-C in base form regardless.
 
Why is Piccolo considered stronger than the two again?
In the fight with Buutenks, his overwhelming strength only lasted 30 minutes, and after that, he was mostly just Super Buu with Piccolo's strength added in such Goku became confident him and Goku could beat him without fusing. Piccolo had more weight in amping him than Goten or Trunks.
 
That simply meant Goten was a lot stronger than Gohan was when he was his age. Gohan was 9 (And 10 physically, but 9 according to his living world birth record when he became SSJ2) when he first became a SSJ while Goten is only 7. And having potential to surpass Gohan doesn't quite mean he was that close. Though he'd be At least 4-C in base form regardless.
Then, is it possible to make goten high 4C in base during super? Since he's 13 (16 in the movie)?
 
Pretty sure Goten and Trunks are indeed a lot stronger in Super than they were in Buu saga; no reason for them to be weaker than the likes of Krillin or Tien IMO. But that's off topic; the main argument here is Teen Gohan/Buu saga Gohan being High 4-C even in base form.
 
Actually when there's two versions of Buucolo.

The first one is when the kids are still inside him and the other one is when it's just Piccolo inside him (which is shown when Goku and Vegeta were saving everyone) so it seems the kids do have an impact on Super buu's power even when unfused.
 
Actually when there's two versions of Buucolo.

The first one is when the kids are still inside him and the other one is when it's just Piccolo inside him (which is shown when Goku and Vegeta were saving everyone) so it seems the kids do have an impact on Super buu's power even when unfused.
The other version only lasted for seconds, and doesn't fight anyone most importantly. But Buuculo existing is pretty much the reason Piccolo is considered stronger than Goten and Trunks at least the base forms.
 
How many more agreements do we need?

Also is it possible to include the goten stuff as well since its very small and doesn't need a crt?
 
Not bad flower man.
This changes a few things.
1. Base Goten and trunks scale to base Gohan so they are massively upgraded.
2. Dabura and cell can now compete with SSJ Goku and Vegeta.
3. Piccolo is massively upgraded.
I agree with this.

Also why do you call cell by the "it" pronoun? Cell is always referred to as male.
 
1. Base Goten and trunks scale to base Gohan so they are massively upgraded.
Goten is never explicitly stated to be equal to Gohan. The Daizenshuu 2 only makes note of the fact that his power is in the same ballpark as his older brother, highlighting his extraordinary latent potential. In the manga, during their sparring match, Goten was unable to land a single hit on Gohan, and Gohan only ever expressed concern about his potential and his rate of growth, rather than his power at the present moment. Although, an argument could still be made for Goten and Trunks to be 4-C scaling off of Android 18 and Frieza (according to the El Manga Legendario).
2. Dabura and cell can now compete with SSJ Goku and Vegeta.
ehh...
3. Piccolo is massively upgraded.
Piccolo himself described the Supreme Kai and in a league of his own, and Gohan scales above the Supreme Kai.
 
Goten is never explicitly stated to be equal to Gohan. The Daizenshuu 2 only makes note of the fact that his power is in the same ballpark as his older brother, highlighting his extraordinary latent potential. In the manga, during their sparring match, Goten was unable to land a single hit on Gohan, and Gohan only ever expressed concern about his potential and his rate of growth, rather than his power at the present moment. Although, an argument could still be made for Goten and Trunks to be 4-C scaling off of Android 18 and Frieza (according to the El Manga Legendario).

ehh...

Piccolo himself described the Supreme Kai and in a league of his own, and Gohan scales above the Supreme Kai.
I forgot about that. You are completely correct.
 
Not bad flower man.
This changes a few things.
1. Base Goten and trunks scale to base Gohan so they are massively upgraded.
2. Dabura and cell can now compete with SSJ Goku and Vegeta.
3. Piccolo is massively upgraded.
I agree with this.

Also why do you call cell by the "it" pronoun? Cell is always referred to as male.
But that makes
base goten ~ base gohan > shin > piccolo > base goten

We either use gohans statement for dbs since goten is older or we remove "stronger than base goten and trunks" from piccolos profile
 
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