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Eternity (Multi-Eternity) vs The Thought Robot

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Don't know how this one will go. Eternity should be stronger (embodiment of an infinite dimensional multiverse>>>>>>>>>>infinite dimensional being) but I don't think that they can get past each other's Regenerationn.
 
Beyond the DC Multiverse... Umm... Explain how CAS/TR & Mandrakk were destroyed immediately ? Explain how The Endless completely ignored what was going on ? Explain how the Presence did not care about what was going on ?
 
Kaltias said:
Don't know how this one will go. Eternity should be stronger (embodiment of an infinite dimensional multiverse>>>>>>>>>>infinite dimensional being) but I don't think that they can get past each other's Regenerationn.
Click to expand...
TR has high-godly regen, eternity has mid-godly.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
Beyond the DC Multiverse... Umm... Explain how CAS/TR & Mandrakk were destroyed immediately ? Explain how The Endless completely ignored what was going on ? Explain how the Presence did not care about what was going on ?
Click to expand...
Isn't TR in his story in the highest place of the DC cosmology? I mean transcending the story itself should be somewhat high, right?
 
Because Superman's story being the greatest story ever is only an opinion. And because fourth wall feats aren't applicable in a battle forum.

And because the majority of CA's powers are basically what every main character in fiction has.

And story manipulation is just reality warping + breaking the fourth wall, and as far as reality warping goes, TR isn't even that impressive compared to the higher tiers.

And TR being a living story is just a plot device. And plot devices aren't applicable in a battle forum, even if the character embodies plot devices.

And simply saying TR will overcome every challenge because the story of Superman is to overcome every challenge isn't a valid argument because every protagonist in fiction overcomes his challenges and becomes triumphant in the end.

And because in a battle forum, only the feats he has shown are applicable, not what he's supposedly capable of being outside of the story.

And because having meta-story powers are only applicable to the universe the character is from, and would have no meaning in a neutral universe. DC may have a standard for being between fiction and the real world, but that logic wouldn't be applicable to any other universe.

And he's not actually outside of the story, and doesn't actually create his own story, it's the writer that's both of those things, and in a neutral universe, he wouldn't be outside of the story or create the story at all.

And how great you think the story is has no impact on a battle forum, even if TR is a physical representation of the story.


anyway i think posibility will win via Plot Manipulation (in alow scale) But Eternity Itself is an Infinite dimencional being :I


edit: forgot to put the link, sry:https://comicvine.gamespot.com/supe...nderrated-1627773/?page=1#js-message-13503537
 
You alright man? that was a long winded post for such a small mention of that argument. (Unless someone deleted a comment or something)

Onto the fight about "Infinite Dimensional beings", To be fair though, CA Superman was beyond that of the highest dimensional tier of the DC Universe, hell, he envisioned what was Limbo, which surrounds the bleed, which holds almost all the dimension and multiverses of DC in a space smaller than his hand. And both Mandrakk and him were on a power level that even beings that existed in that Infinite Dimensional space were easily killed and tossed away without much worry.

Monitors are also Infinite-Dimensional beings, as they exist in the highest realm of existence, Monitor Space. And they specifically designed CA Superman to be far above anything they could do, their ultimate weapon against a Monitor who was shattering the very fabric of existence itself, even Monitor Space. The Monitor's were like ants to them, and their power kept growing and growing.

And it does make sense that Mandrakk was still a threat to an Infinite Dimensional Multiverse and not be a threat to the Presence... simpy put, the Presence is far beyond that of an Infinite Multiverse, and probably wouldn't care about that fight (He certaintly hasn't given a shit about COIE, Infinite Crisis, or Flashpoint ******* up the timeline) since he is Outerverse level.

Honestly, from the fact that Eternity's best feat is that he is the embodiment of an Infinite Dimensional Multiverse, and Cosmic Armor Superman exists at the outskirts of said Multiverse, even in Monitor Space (as the only thing that now surrounds monitor space is the Overvoid, which is so large and everencompassing that even beings like the Presence are nothing to it) i'd say that that, plus his better Regenerationn, power adaption, and hax resistance, this should be a pretty decent win for Cosmic Armor.
 
There seem to be a lot of misconception here from people who didn't read Superman Beyond and know nothing of New 52 and The Bleed and Orrey of Worlds. First off, Monitor Sphere is only the highest in the Local Multiverse, which is only 52 universes. The Bleed is a 4-Dimensional space and TR was struggling against Mandrakk wielding 4-Dimensional powers. Superman being his own plot and a "better story" is simply an opinion and a plot device that has literally no meaning anywhere else but DC b/c Morrison wants to go all "plot/story powers" on everything.

No, TR is not infinite-dimensional, and no, he's not beyond infinite universes. He never displayed plot manipulation; he only displayed the ability to adapt to a being using 4-Dimensional powers. Them going into the Overvoid is no huge feat considering Wally did it and so did countless Vertigo characters that were not beyond 3-D character level. Superman saw one of the Writers; does that mean he's infinite-dimensional and has plot manipulation?

The "carrying an infinite book" feat is a huge outlier if you actually read Superman Beyond. Captain Marvel and Ultraman weren't even capable of holding a few hundred to thousand-tonner ship as it went through different universes. It was by no means infinite in weight, and they could not actually hold it up. The book is an outlier and a terrible feat to use.

To make it more concise: Monitor Sphere is not infinite-dimensional and neither is the Local Multiverse. The Bleed is 4-D and was keeping a good fight against TR. He's not infinite-dimensional either. Mr. Mxyzptlk curbstomps TR and he's not infinite-dimensional and has way better feats.

Not to mention, even if this were happening at an infinite-dimensional scale, The Presence, Lucifer, The Endless; any Vertigo characters at that conceptual level would've come in and shitstomped Mandrakk and TR for ******* with the universe. But they didn't. Because TR and Mandrakk were just messing around in the 4th dimension and only fighting over 52 measly universes.
 
@Fatherofdemons you should actually start a content revision thread with this information, because according to you Thought Robot is only 2-C while on this wiki he's rated as High 1-B.
 
Fatherofdemons said:
There seem to be a lot of misconception here from people who didn't read Superman Beyond and know nothing of New 52 and The Bleed and Orrey of Worlds. First off, Monitor Sphere is only the highest in the Local Multiverse, which is only 52 universes. The Bleed is a 4-Dimensional space and TR was struggling against Mandrakk wielding 4-Dimensional powers. Superman being his own plot and a "better story" is simply an opinion and a plot device that has literally no meaning anywhere else but DC b/c Morrison wants to go all "plot/story powers" on everything.
No, TR is not infinite-dimensional, and no, he's not beyond infinite universes. He never displayed plot manipulation; he only displayed the ability to adapt to a being using 4-Dimensional powers. Them going into the Overvoid is no huge feat considering Wally did it and so did countless Vertigo characters that were not beyond 3-D character level. Superman saw one of the Writers; does that mean he's infinite-dimensional and has plot manipulation?

The "carrying an infinite book" feat is a huge outlier if you actually read Superman Beyond. Captain Marvel and Ultraman weren't even capable of holding a few hundred to thousand-tonner ship as it went through different universes. It was by no means infinite in weight, and they could not actually hold it up. The book is an outlier and a terrible feat to use.

To make it more concise: Monitor Sphere is not infinite-dimensional and neither is the Local Multiverse. The Bleed is 4-D and was keeping a good fight against TR. He's not infinite-dimensional either. Mr. Mxyzptlk curbstomps TR and he's not infinite-dimensional and has way better feats.

Not to mention, even if this were happening at an infinite-dimensional scale, The Presence, Lucifer, The Endless; any Vertigo characters at that conceptual level would've come in and shitstomped Mandrakk and TR for ******* with the universe. But they didn't. Because TR and Mandrakk were just messing around in the 4th dimension and only fighting over 52 measly universes.
Click to expand...
(This is a do-over comment, because it seems my last one was deleted. if it wasn't, i will delete this as well after)

1. This is not a content revision board, if you want to display that you think that Cosmic Armor Superman was overexaggerated in power, then go take it up with the Content Revision Board, who will look at your evidence and decide if your evidence means anything.

No reason to derail this thread if you think the argument is wrong.

2. Not only can i not find much evidence of anything in Superman Beyond being stated as 4-D (and even then, never suggesting that they only operate at 4-D level.) Your argument over Mandrakk's power level itself doesn't make sense. Mandrakk was considered the big bad of the entire Final Crisis story line, even above someone like Darkseid, who in the story was strong enough to destroy the ENTIRE DC MULTIVERSE, not just the 52 universes of Post-Infinite Crisis. Not only that, a weaker replacement Mandrakk was able to defeat both Radiant and the Spectre without any trouble, both of which were at full power in the tie-in comics of Final Crisis.

A Full Power Spectre is able to tangle with the Anti-Monitor, who is, i'm pretty sure, above 52 Universes in power. By your logic, Spectre not only would've shit stomped the second Mandrakk, but the first Mandrakk without even breaking a sweat.

Hell, why couldn't Swamp Thing do it? By your logic, he would have destroyed Mandrakk in a milisecond.

3. Isn't the Monitor Sphere above Limbo? Which surrounds the Bleed, which has been mentioned multiple times to encompass MULTIPLE Multiverses? And it's never been mentioned (at least to my knowledge) that there are multiple Bleeds and multiple Limbo's, but only one of each that exists at the highest dimensional tier of each respective part of the Multiverse. And the Monitor Sphere viewed that as insignifcant as a large pizza.

4. Yes, others have accessed the Overvoid before, but Monitor's exist on the EDGE of the Overvoid, something no other dimension has ever shown to do. This makes sense, as since they are the closest to the Overvoid on the map, they would live at the highest level of existence, but still be dwarfed by the size of the void itself.

5. Name a single instance where, in a major event comic, that the Presence has just come in and said "No, you can't do that anymore". He didn't do it in Crisis on Infinite Earths (when an INFINITE Multiverse was at stake), he didn't do it when the Ultimator destroyed the 10th, 9th, 8th, 7th and 6th Dimension, he didn't give a shit when Infinite Crisis ****** up the Multiverse even more, he didn't stop Convergence, and he has almost never gotten strictly involved in any event besides Day of Vengeance.

The obvious answer is that

A.) Vertigo doesnt mingle all the time with DC.

B.) That woulr ruin the drama of the story if the Presence just fixed everything

C.) Even if if was a threat to Infinite-Dimensions, it would still be insignificant to any of those characters, as they are Outerverse level. Morningstar didn't even give a shit when God disappeared out of heaven, his own father, so why would he care if some jackass was destroying the Monitor sphere and below? That's nothing to him.

And finally

In the story, the characters mention multiple times that the threat that is happening affects ALL of existence.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/37889/1122338-843457_29653798_super.jpg

ALL of existence probably doesn't include just 52 Universes and 4 Dimensions. Especially considering we know that the DC Multiverse is infinite.

http://i.imgur.com/mZ7v3RA.png

Cosmic Armor even states that the threat is the ENTIRE Multiverse. Not just a local one.

So, unless Monitors and CA Superman were too close minded to know that there were Multiple Multiverses in the DCU... i doubt they were bluffing.

However, if you have any more proof about this, send it to the revision board. See what they say.
 
Jared1111 said:
Fatherofdemons said:
There seem to be a lot of misconception here from people who didn't read Superman Beyond and know nothing of New 52 and The Bleed and Orrey of Worlds. First off, Monitor Sphere is only the highest in the Local Multiverse, which is only 52 universes. The Bleed is a 4-Dimensional space and TR was struggling against Mandrakk wielding 4-Dimensional powers. Superman being his own plot and a "better story" is simply an opinion and a plot device that has literally no meaning anywhere else but DC b/c Morrison wants to go all "plot/story powers" on everything.
No, TR is not infinite-dimensional, and no, he's not beyond infinite universes. He never displayed plot manipulation; he only displayed the ability to adapt to a being using 4-Dimensional powers. Them going into the Overvoid is no huge feat considering Wally did it and so did countless Vertigo characters that were not beyond 3-D character level. Superman saw one of the Writers; does that mean he's infinite-dimensional and has plot manipulation?

The "carrying an infinite book" feat is a huge outlier if you actually read Superman Beyond. Captain Marvel and Ultraman weren't even capable of holding a few hundred to thousand-tonner ship as it went through different universes. It was by no means infinite in weight, and they could not actually hold it up. The book is an outlier and a terrible feat to use.

To make it more concise: Monitor Sphere is not infinite-dimensional and neither is the Local Multiverse. The Bleed is 4-D and was keeping a good fight against TR. He's not infinite-dimensional either. Mr. Mxyzptlk curbstomps TR and he's not infinite-dimensional and has way better feats.

Not to mention, even if this were happening at an infinite-dimensional scale, The Presence, Lucifer, The Endless; any Vertigo characters at that conceptual level would've come in and shitstomped Mandrakk and TR for ******* with the universe. But they didn't. Because TR and Mandrakk were just messing around in the 4th dimension and only fighting over 52 measly universes.
Click to expand...
(This is a do-over comment, because it seems my last one was deleted. if it wasn't, i will delete this as well after)
1. This is not a content revision board, if you want to display that you think that Cosmic Armor Superman was overexaggerated in power, then go take it up with the Content Revision Board, who will look at your evidence and decide if your evidence means anything.

No reason to derail this thread if you think the argument is wrong.

2. Not only can i not find much evidence of anything in Superman Beyond being stated as 4-D (and even then, never suggesting that they only operate at 4-D level.) Your argument over Mandrakk's power level itself doesn't make sense. Mandrakk was considered the big bad of the entire Final Crisis story line, even above someone like Darkseid, who in the story was strong enough to destroy the ENTIRE DC MULTIVERSE, not just the 52 universes of Post-Infinite Crisis. Not only that, a weaker replacement Mandrakk was able to defeat both Radiant and the Spectre without any trouble, both of which were at full power in the tie-in comics of Final Crisis.

A Full Power Spectre is able to tangle with the Anti-Monitor, who is, i'm pretty sure, above 52 Universes in power. By your logic, Spectre not only would've shit stomped the second Mandrakk, but the first Mandrakk without even breaking a sweat.

Hell, why couldn't Swamp Thing do it? By your logic, he would have destroyed Mandrakk in a milisecond.

3. Isn't the Monitor Sphere above Limbo? Which surrounds the Bleed, which has been mentioned multiple times to encompass MULTIPLE Multiverses? And it's never been mentioned (at least to my knowledge) that there are multiple Bleeds and multiple Limbo's, but only one of each that exists at the highest dimensional tier of each respective part of the Multiverse. And the Monitor Sphere viewed that as insignifcant as a large pizza.

4. Yes, others have accessed the Overvoid before, but Monitor's exist on the EDGE of the Overvoid, something no other dimension has ever shown to do. This makes sense, as since they are the closest to the Overvoid on the map, they would live at the highest level of existence, but still be dwarfed by the size of the void itself.

5. Name a single instance where, in a major event comic, that the Presence has just come in and said "No, you can't do that anymore". He didn't do it in Crisis on Infinite Earths (when an INFINITE Multiverse was at stake), he didn't do it when the Ultimator destroyed the 10th, 9th, 8th, 7th and 6th Dimension, he didn't give a shit when Infinite Crisis ****** up the Multiverse even more, he didn't stop Convergence, and he has almost never gotten strictly involved in any event besides Day of Vengeance.

The obvious answer is that

A.) Vertigo doesnt mingle all the time with DC.

B.) That woulr ruin the drama of the story if the Presence just fixed everything

C.) Even if if was a threat to Infinite-Dimensions, it would still be insignificant to any of those characters, as they are Outerverse level. Morningstar didn't even give a shit when God disappeared out of heaven, his own father, so why would he care if some jackass was destroying the Monitor sphere and below? That's nothing to him.

And finally

In the story, the characters mention multiple times that the threat that is happening affects ALL of existence.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/37889/1122338-843457_29653798_super.jpg

ALL of existence probably doesn't include just 52 Universes and 4 Dimensions. Especially considering we know that the DC Multiverse is infinite.

http://i.imgur.com/mZ7v3RA.png

[Cosmic Armor Superman SPECIFICALLY said that the threat was to the ENTIRE Multiverse. ]

So, unless Monitors and CA Superman were too close minded to know that there were Multiple Multiverses in the DCU... i doubt they were bluffing.

However, if you have any more proof about this, send it to the revision board. See what they say.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry, but just saying "to the ENTIRE multiverse" means nothing when it's only 52 universes. Did you not see the picture where he's only larger than 52 universes? Should I get the panel for you?

In Multiversity, The Bleed is stated to be 4-Dimensional or 5-Dimensional; forgot. Regardless, none of that is beyond Mr. Mxyzptlk. There are 52 Monitors; one for each universe. That derails your whole argument about there being infinite universes at the time of this comic. There were only 52 at the time of Final Crisis, literally nothing says otherwise. Please provide feats to disprove me on this. With timestamps on the scans, as Convergence (when DC was a whole was actually made infinite again) started on April of 2015. The Monitors are only within the Local Multiverse, and the Multiversity map tells you that. Dunno why you're fighting Grant Morrison on this.

Saying "all of existence" means nothing when it's only 52 universes. Your argument holds no merit. A block of text bigger than mine to say that little.
 
@Jared1111

I'd also like to add that everything excluding Final Crisis was only affecting the 3-Dimensional universe that the comics focus on. Mr. Mxyzptlk and the like were unaffected, otherwise they would've stepped in and done something.

So...
 
Fatherofdemons said:
Too much work.
Click to expand...
You just posted a whole essay on why Thought Robot isn't as powerful as he's portrayed on this wiki. I highly doubt making a Content Revision thread about it, which will mostly consist of you compiling the posts you made here would be "too much work" for you.
 
FTW395 said:
Fatherofdemons said:
Too much work.
Click to expand...
You just posted a whole essay on why Thought Robot isn't as powerful as he's portrayed on this wiki. I highly doubt making a Content Revision thread about it, which will mostly consist of you compiling the posts you made here would be "too much work" for you.
Click to expand...
Nah they'll want scans for every single word. And I really don't want to look through all that.
 
This thread is giving me aneurysms from how false it is.

FOD, just do yourself a favor and look at the map of the DC Multiverse.

Monitor-Space is the highest dimension of all.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
This thread is giving me aneurysms from how false it is.
FOD, just do yourself a favor and look at the map of the DC Multiverse.

Monitor-Space is the highest dimension of all.
Click to expand...
Facepalm. Do yourself a favor and realize there's only 52 universes there. That isn't saying anything when Bleedspace is only 5-Dimensional if you actually even read Multiversity. Do yourself a favor and read the comics yourself without making bad interpretations this time.

Also, to tie in to an earlier discussion; The Presence let Carnivore take his power to see what happened. Your whole argument on that point is more mute than mute can be.
 
 
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