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This thread was gonna actually be me explaining my points about why 4-A Danny Phantom was possibly but while going through my notes, I found that there is something far more consistent and will make scaling the strongest ghosts easy and will have little to no inconsistencies.
4-A Removal
Realm Creation
When I first brought this up, I didn't see many issues with scaling the strongest ghosts to this since they didn't have any anti-feats suggesting that they couldn't be this strong but when looking at it now, is a big issue with this and I'll explain.
First statement was in the episode "Prisoners of Love". In this episode, Danny goes into the Ghost Zone and enters on of the floating doors. It leads him to a small room and when Danny tries to talk to the ghost but it transforms and shouts "Get out of my room!". Danny quickly leaves and states "Each one of these doors lead to another ghosts lair".
The next two statements are from the episode "Reign Storm", Ember states Pariah Dark "already destroyed all our homes". Later Danny states "The ghosts are all off rebuilding their homes"
Finally Butch Hartman stated each ghost kingdom is made of it's own unique energy. This is supported in the episode "The Ultimate Enemy" were the boo-merang is stated to "Home in on a ghosts unique ectoplasmic signature".
These suggest ghosts used their own energy to create their homes. However, the statements used regarding ghosts being the creators of their own realm don't provide use with enough solid evidence to suggest they created the entire dimensions (space and time) themselves. We've seen ghosts create constructs but never anything like dimensions.
While words like home, world, realm and lair are all used to describe their dimensions, it is impossible to say what they are really talking about and considering Butch uses two constructs when talking about the kingdoms being made of unique energy, the best assumption is that they are just talking about the buildings.
With that stated, I believe 4-A via realm creation in Danny Phantom is invalid and should not be used. This will also remove the combat inapplicable powers (Space, Time, and Pocket Reality Manipulation) since those came from the realm creation.
Reality Gauntlet
The Top Tiers are also scaled to Freakshow's feat with the Reality Gauntlet
While the gauntlet uses ectoplasmic energy to preform it's feats. It's still reality warping which at the end of the day can't be used for scaling attack potency. Plus we don't truly know what Freakshow did in the end, you could argue he moved the sun, warped reality and created a starry sky, or just turned day to night. The fact that the feat can be seen as multiple things and it is reality warping so scaling it to the Top Tiers is faulty. I suggest rating the Reality Gauntlet at Unknown to be accurate until something else is found.
Solid Tier 6
Tier 6 Danny Phantom top tiers is far more consistent than Tier 4 in regards of scaling and power.
Vortex
In the episode "Torrent of Terror", Vortex causes a planetary storm which is Low 6-B.
Soul Shredder
In the episode "Fright Night", the soul shredder causes a storm to form in the sky using it's energy. The Fright Knight states "Once this storm touches every corner of this globe". This means the Soul Shredder has the power to create a planetary storm which is Low 6-B.
Pariah Dark up-scales from both of these since he is stated to be "a ghost of such power and magnitude, only he could control the energy contained within the crown of fire and the ring of rage". Butch Hartman also states that when wearing both, the user gains omnipotence. Obviously he is saying it is the strongest power in the verse.
Ecto-Skeleton
The ecto-skeleton Danny used to fight Pariah Dark was stated to multiply the wearers natural abilities 100fold. This actually makes Danny 6-C!. I was told by Mr.Bambu that if ypu divide Vortex's planetary storm calc by 100 you get 39 Gigatons which is 6-C and not to far above Dorathea's High 7-A feat which is 2.46 Gigatons and was casual.
This also supports Massively FTL Top Tiers since Pariah's feat was already accepted to be an unknown degree in the massively ftl. Using the 100x multiplier on Danny's speed would put him around 300x the speed of light which would be consistent with Massively FTL Pariah.
Here is Pariah's thread https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/4068209
So not only do we have a two Low 6-B feats for the Top Tiers to scale too. We also have a stated multiplier that makes season 2 Danny 6-C by using Vortex as a base for Pariah's power and dividing it by 100, we have a casual High 7-A feat consistent since Danny being at this level at the least would make the boost he received from the Ecto-Skeleton consistent with the new top tier ratings.
Scaling Suggestions
Top Tiers
Pariah Dark
Tier: At least Low 6-B
Attack Potency: At least Small Country level+ (Stated to be a ghost of such power and magnitude that only he could control the power contained within the Crown of Fire and the Ring of Rage which are stated to give you power unimaginable, making him stronger than both Vortex and the Soul Shredder which can create planetary storms, more powerful than Ecto-Skeleton Danny Phantom, who's natural base abilities were multiplied by a hundredfold)
Speed: At least Massively FTL (Faster than Ecto-Skeleton Danny Phantom, who's natural base abilities was multiplied a hundredfold, crossed interplanetary and Interstellar distances in a single day without being at full power)
Note: The other top tiers will have the same statistics with different descriptions.
Season 2 and 3 Statistics
If the multiplier is accepted Season 2 and 3 Danny's Tier/AP would look like this.
Tier: 6-C | At least 6-C, possibly Low 6-B
Attack Potency: Island level (Could harm Aragon in his dragon form with his Ghost Ray, his base power should be around this level since the Ecto-Skeleton multiplied his power by a hundredfold and allowed him to somewhat fight Pariah Dark, with the later even commenting on his strength) | At least Island level, possibly Small Country level+ (At least as strong as before and should be comparable to people that can harm him)
Key: Season 2 | Season 3
In the link below, we have already had a discussion about character scaling and it was decided that possibly scaling Danny to Aragon and Vortex was the best option. If this multiplier is accepted as support, it should be enough proof for us to solidly scale Danny to Aragon. Vortex will still be considered possibly but this will remove the At least 8-A ratings from season 2 and 3.
https://vsbattles.com/threads/danny-phantom-revisions-part-2-scaling-revision.108075/
Issues?
I don't see any issues with using this multiplier but if someone wants to know if this is an outlier I'll explain why it's not. Season 1 Danny's 8-A+ feat happened in the first episode and I posted multiple times he has shown to get stronger in my part 2 thread. Add in the fact that season 2 took place over several months, this multiplier which when divided from Vortex's calc gives us 39 Gigatons 6-C which is not to far from Dorathea's 2.46 Gigaton feat that she didn't struggle to do at all
Another issue is if the multiplier is valid?. Yes, the 100x multiplier for the suit is valid. The statement comes straight from Maddie Fenton, who worked on the suit and has no reason to lie about what it can do. Plus the result would be backed by another feat. So it's consistent with scaling and the statement comes from one of the smartest people in the verse who worked on it. Maddie's tech pretty much always does what it's stated to do.
is this calc stacking?. No, calc stacking would be taking the results of one calc and using them in another to get an inflated result. This is simply using Vortex as a base for Ecto-Skeleton Danny and Pariah (who are stronger than him) and dividing his calc by 100 to find Danny's base power since the Ecto-Skeleton multiplied base Danny's strength and speed 100x.
And Finally. Is Vortex's feat just Environmental Destruction?. I was told we treat storm feats as Environmental Destruction, but as the page says, it can be used as AP if it qualifies. Well I don't know if I explained this before but Vortex's AP would scale to the storm feat. Like all ghosts, his attacks are made from his own ectoplasmic energy. During the episode, it is stated and shown that the planetary storm had Vortex's face in it and Vortex himself states "I am the perfect storm". He created it using his own energy like all ghosts, and he uses this energy for his attacks. Also, as soon as he was sealed in the thermos, all his weather effects ended.
4-A Removal
Realm Creation
When I first brought this up, I didn't see many issues with scaling the strongest ghosts to this since they didn't have any anti-feats suggesting that they couldn't be this strong but when looking at it now, is a big issue with this and I'll explain.
First statement was in the episode "Prisoners of Love". In this episode, Danny goes into the Ghost Zone and enters on of the floating doors. It leads him to a small room and when Danny tries to talk to the ghost but it transforms and shouts "Get out of my room!". Danny quickly leaves and states "Each one of these doors lead to another ghosts lair".
The next two statements are from the episode "Reign Storm", Ember states Pariah Dark "already destroyed all our homes". Later Danny states "The ghosts are all off rebuilding their homes"
Finally Butch Hartman stated each ghost kingdom is made of it's own unique energy. This is supported in the episode "The Ultimate Enemy" were the boo-merang is stated to "Home in on a ghosts unique ectoplasmic signature".
These suggest ghosts used their own energy to create their homes. However, the statements used regarding ghosts being the creators of their own realm don't provide use with enough solid evidence to suggest they created the entire dimensions (space and time) themselves. We've seen ghosts create constructs but never anything like dimensions.
While words like home, world, realm and lair are all used to describe their dimensions, it is impossible to say what they are really talking about and considering Butch uses two constructs when talking about the kingdoms being made of unique energy, the best assumption is that they are just talking about the buildings.
With that stated, I believe 4-A via realm creation in Danny Phantom is invalid and should not be used. This will also remove the combat inapplicable powers (Space, Time, and Pocket Reality Manipulation) since those came from the realm creation.
Reality Gauntlet
The Top Tiers are also scaled to Freakshow's feat with the Reality Gauntlet
While the gauntlet uses ectoplasmic energy to preform it's feats. It's still reality warping which at the end of the day can't be used for scaling attack potency. Plus we don't truly know what Freakshow did in the end, you could argue he moved the sun, warped reality and created a starry sky, or just turned day to night. The fact that the feat can be seen as multiple things and it is reality warping so scaling it to the Top Tiers is faulty. I suggest rating the Reality Gauntlet at Unknown to be accurate until something else is found.
Solid Tier 6
Tier 6 Danny Phantom top tiers is far more consistent than Tier 4 in regards of scaling and power.
Vortex
In the episode "Torrent of Terror", Vortex causes a planetary storm which is Low 6-B.
Soul Shredder
In the episode "Fright Night", the soul shredder causes a storm to form in the sky using it's energy. The Fright Knight states "Once this storm touches every corner of this globe". This means the Soul Shredder has the power to create a planetary storm which is Low 6-B.
Pariah Dark up-scales from both of these since he is stated to be "a ghost of such power and magnitude, only he could control the energy contained within the crown of fire and the ring of rage". Butch Hartman also states that when wearing both, the user gains omnipotence. Obviously he is saying it is the strongest power in the verse.
Ecto-Skeleton
The ecto-skeleton Danny used to fight Pariah Dark was stated to multiply the wearers natural abilities 100fold. This actually makes Danny 6-C!. I was told by Mr.Bambu that if ypu divide Vortex's planetary storm calc by 100 you get 39 Gigatons which is 6-C and not to far above Dorathea's High 7-A feat which is 2.46 Gigatons and was casual.
This also supports Massively FTL Top Tiers since Pariah's feat was already accepted to be an unknown degree in the massively ftl. Using the 100x multiplier on Danny's speed would put him around 300x the speed of light which would be consistent with Massively FTL Pariah.
Here is Pariah's thread https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/4068209
So not only do we have a two Low 6-B feats for the Top Tiers to scale too. We also have a stated multiplier that makes season 2 Danny 6-C by using Vortex as a base for Pariah's power and dividing it by 100, we have a casual High 7-A feat consistent since Danny being at this level at the least would make the boost he received from the Ecto-Skeleton consistent with the new top tier ratings.
Scaling Suggestions
Top Tiers
Pariah Dark
Tier: At least Low 6-B
Attack Potency: At least Small Country level+ (Stated to be a ghost of such power and magnitude that only he could control the power contained within the Crown of Fire and the Ring of Rage which are stated to give you power unimaginable, making him stronger than both Vortex and the Soul Shredder which can create planetary storms, more powerful than Ecto-Skeleton Danny Phantom, who's natural base abilities were multiplied by a hundredfold)
Speed: At least Massively FTL (Faster than Ecto-Skeleton Danny Phantom, who's natural base abilities was multiplied a hundredfold, crossed interplanetary and Interstellar distances in a single day without being at full power)
Note: The other top tiers will have the same statistics with different descriptions.
Season 2 and 3 Statistics
If the multiplier is accepted Season 2 and 3 Danny's Tier/AP would look like this.
Tier: 6-C | At least 6-C, possibly Low 6-B
Attack Potency: Island level (Could harm Aragon in his dragon form with his Ghost Ray, his base power should be around this level since the Ecto-Skeleton multiplied his power by a hundredfold and allowed him to somewhat fight Pariah Dark, with the later even commenting on his strength) | At least Island level, possibly Small Country level+ (At least as strong as before and should be comparable to people that can harm him)
Key: Season 2 | Season 3
In the link below, we have already had a discussion about character scaling and it was decided that possibly scaling Danny to Aragon and Vortex was the best option. If this multiplier is accepted as support, it should be enough proof for us to solidly scale Danny to Aragon. Vortex will still be considered possibly but this will remove the At least 8-A ratings from season 2 and 3.
https://vsbattles.com/threads/danny-phantom-revisions-part-2-scaling-revision.108075/
Issues?
I don't see any issues with using this multiplier but if someone wants to know if this is an outlier I'll explain why it's not. Season 1 Danny's 8-A+ feat happened in the first episode and I posted multiple times he has shown to get stronger in my part 2 thread. Add in the fact that season 2 took place over several months, this multiplier which when divided from Vortex's calc gives us 39 Gigatons 6-C which is not to far from Dorathea's 2.46 Gigaton feat that she didn't struggle to do at all
Another issue is if the multiplier is valid?. Yes, the 100x multiplier for the suit is valid. The statement comes straight from Maddie Fenton, who worked on the suit and has no reason to lie about what it can do. Plus the result would be backed by another feat. So it's consistent with scaling and the statement comes from one of the smartest people in the verse who worked on it. Maddie's tech pretty much always does what it's stated to do.
is this calc stacking?. No, calc stacking would be taking the results of one calc and using them in another to get an inflated result. This is simply using Vortex as a base for Ecto-Skeleton Danny and Pariah (who are stronger than him) and dividing his calc by 100 to find Danny's base power since the Ecto-Skeleton multiplied base Danny's strength and speed 100x.
And Finally. Is Vortex's feat just Environmental Destruction?. I was told we treat storm feats as Environmental Destruction, but as the page says, it can be used as AP if it qualifies. Well I don't know if I explained this before but Vortex's AP would scale to the storm feat. Like all ghosts, his attacks are made from his own ectoplasmic energy. During the episode, it is stated and shown that the planetary storm had Vortex's face in it and Vortex himself states "I am the perfect storm". He created it using his own energy like all ghosts, and he uses this energy for his attacks. Also, as soon as he was sealed in the thermos, all his weather effects ended.
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