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Cosmology rating and possible Conceptual Manipulation upgrade - Maou Gakuin

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Not open for further replies.
imZer0Null said:
A summary:

The cosmology's rating is accepted.

Characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key are "Uncountable * 21" in the Low 2-C tier.
Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos are "Countless * 100 (99+)" in the 2-B tier.

The Conceptual Manipulation Type 2 upgrade is not accepted.
Certain characters now gain higher potency Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

(Order = Laws & Concepts)
Since order in a deeper layer has an uncountably greater affect on reality than order in shallow layer, characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key that can manipulate laws and concepts in a deep layer would be able to overpower 21 layers of resistance, while Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos would be able to overpower 100 (99+) layers of resistance to Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

Is this agreeable?
Click to expand...
. . .
 
imZer0Null said:
Hello. This thread's purpose IS NOT to upgrade the verse's cosmology rating to Tier 1.
This thread was created to confirm how strong the verse currently is rated and possibly upgrade some characters' Conceptual Manipulation...

I will be using info from this blog. While I acknowledge it probably has some mistakes, it's at least more detailed and overall better than the previous 1-B Maou Gakuin CRT. I would recommend reading the blog before continuing...
vsbattles.fandom.com

Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha: Terminology & Cosmology

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

From the blog:

A summary for Maou Gakuin's cosmology:

The multiverse (Silver Sea) is comprised of 99+ layers (Each layer possibly having infinite size), with each layer containing countless universes (Worlds), all of which are separate space-time continuums in the shape of bubbles.

Layers 1 to 10 are classified as Shallow Layers. Layers 11 to 20 are classified as Middle Layers. Layers 21+ are classified as Deep Layers.

Those are the classifications when taking the entire multiverse into account. Layer 2 would still be called a deep layer by someone from Layer 1, and Layer 21 would still be called a shallow layer by someone from Layer 22.

The overall "strength", meaning attack potency, durability and speed, as well as the "strength" of laws and concepts from a deep world is at least uncountably greater than that of a shallow world. The difference between layers is directly compared to the difference between dimensions.

Deep layer inhabitants can use shallow universes as shogi pieces, while only the strongest inhabitant of a shallow universe can use their own universe as a shogi piece, though this is only possible with the help of a deep layer inhabitant.

Spells capable of destroying an entire universe (Space-time continuum) from a shallow layer cannot destroy an ordinary object in a deep layer.

Current Cosmology rating:

Currently, all characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key are at least 21 layers deep in the Silver Sea.

It's been accepted in a previous CRT that all these characters are Low 2-C.
Since they are 21 layers deep in the Silver Sea, and the difference between layers (the overall "strength", meaning attack potency, durability and speed, as well as the "strength" of laws and concepts) is at least uncountable, they would all be rated "Uncountable * 21" in the Low 2-C tier.

Venuzdonoa can destroy all things in creation, regardless of how strong, eternal or infinite they are, which would include the Silver Sea. "True Power" Anos Voldigoad would scale to that, since he's technically superior to Venuzdonoa.
Since both are capable of destroying the Silver Sea, they would be rated "Countless * 100" in the 2-B tier. (100 because 99+ means at least 1 deeper layer is confirmed)

(This won't be added to any profiles. It's only for confirmation)

They also get "Possibly 1-B" because of the difference between layers...

Possible Conceptual Manipulation upgrade:

Please note that I'm not very knowledgeable about the different types of conceptual manipulation.

The order (laws and concepts) in deeper layers are superior to that of shallow layers, so even if you destroy a certain order in a shallow layer, it would still exist in a deeper layer due to the "strength" of order being at least uncountably greater and also independent of what happens in the shallow layer.
This would give characters capable of manipulating concepts in a deeper layer "Conceptual Manipulation Type 2" or "Conceptual Manipulation Type 3, likely Type 2".

**If Conceptual Manipulation Type 2 is not accepted, I have another suggestion.

Characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key that can manipulate *laws and concepts in a deep layer would be able to overpower 21 layers of resistance, while Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos would be able to overpower 100 (99+) layers of resistance to *Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3. (Order = laws and concepts)

Please specify what you agree/disagree with.
Click to expand...
Agreed
 
I prefer that his conceptual manipulation should be of type 2, which actually governs reality, as Anos is shown to destroy orders of deeper worlds. And the Silver Sea contains 99+ layers, i.e its depth is not known. With increase in each layer, its order becomes much more stronger and stronger and stronger and on.....
 
and now how will this work? that anos CM 3 is as strong as a CM 2 but weaker than this since it does not reach type 2, or how his type 3 CM will be compared to others CM type 3... well ... I don't know how it will be applied in combat 👀
 
Dereck03 said:
and now how will this work? that anos CM 3 is as strong as a CM 2 but weaker than this since it does not reach type 2, or how his type 3 CM will be compared to others CM type 3... well ... I don't know how it will be applied in combat 👀
Click to expand...
He'll be able to overpower most characters' Resistance to *Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.
 
Last edited:
imZer0Null said:
He'll be able to overpower most characters' Resistance to Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.
Click to expand...
you got a point ... Ohh please forgive this poor peasant for not being knowledgeable ... Anyway... Well, now the point is how its potency will be clarified in the profile
 
InfiniteCosmology said:
I prefer that his conceptual manipulation should be of type 2, which actually governs reality, as Anos is shown to destroy orders of deeper worlds. And the Silver Sea contains 99+ layers, i.e its depth is not known. With increase in each layer, its order becomes much more stronger and stronger and stronger and on.....
Click to expand...

My main argument for it's being cm2 because the order connected each other with more weight the deeper the layer

It's literally could be considered as govern the shallow universe but well, we don't have feats for the deeper order affecting shallow layer either


I think very strong cm3 should be working than cm2

Maybe someday
 
imZer0Null said:
A summary:

The cosmology's rating is accepted.

Characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key are "Uncountable * 21" in the Low 2-C tier.
Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos are "Countless * 100 (99+)" in the 2-B tier.

The Conceptual Manipulation Type 2 upgrade is not accepted.
Certain characters now gain higher potency Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

(Order = Laws & Concepts)
Since order in a deeper layer has an uncountably greater affect on reality than order in shallow layer, characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key that can manipulate laws and concepts in a deep layer would be able to overpower 21 layers of resistance, while Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos would be able to overpower 100 (99+) layers of resistance to Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

Is this agreeable?
Click to expand...
This seems fine to me at least, but we should probably wait for a bit more staff input.

Also, everybody should tone down the crude or hostile language. This is supposed to be a friendly and polite community in which we constantly collaborate for improvements.
 
imZer0Null said:
A summary:

The cosmology's rating is accepted.

Characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key are "Uncountable * 21" in the Low 2-C tier.
Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos are "Countless * 100 (99+)" in the 2-B tier.

The Conceptual Manipulation Type 2 upgrade is not accepted.
Certain characters now gain higher potency Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

(Order = Laws & Concepts)
Since order in a deeper layer has an uncountably greater affect on reality than order in shallow layer, characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key that can manipulate laws and concepts in a deep layer would be able to overpower 21 layers of resistance, while Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos would be able to overpower 100 (99+) layers of resistance to Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

Is this agreeable?
Click to expand...
Could we perhaps get some staff input on this and finish off the CRT?
 
imZer0Null said:
A summary:

The cosmology's rating is accepted.

Characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key are "Uncountable * 21" in the Low 2-C tier.
Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos are "Countless * 100 (99+)" in the 2-B tier.

The Conceptual Manipulation Type 2 upgrade is not accepted.
Certain characters now gain higher potency Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

(Order = Laws & Concepts)
Since order in a deeper layer has an uncountably greater affect on reality than order in shallow layer, characters with the "Post-Silver Sea" key that can manipulate laws and concepts in a deep layer would be able to overpower 21 layers of resistance, while Venuzdonoa and "True Power" Anos would be able to overpower 100 (99+) layers of resistance to Law Manipulation & Conceptual Manipulation Type 3.

Is this agreeable?
Click to expand...
@LordGriffin1000 @Eficiente @GyroNutz @DarkGrath @The_Wright_Way @Ogbunabali @Moritzva @Firestorm808 @DemonGodMitchAubin @Everything12 @Duedate8898

Your evaluations and input would be appreciated here.
 
I suppose this is fine from reading the OP, I will be honest that I’m not familiar with such high concept and high tier feats tho
 
Last edited:
Do we require any more staff input on this CRT?

Also, should an explanation for the characters' Law Manipulation and Conceptual Manipulation Type 3 potency be added to their profiles or no?
 
I think that we have hopefully received sufficient input now.

I do not know. What is the staff consensus?
 
I think it is obvious that an explanation of the potency in the profile is needed, so that others have access more easily and do not have to look for so much explanation about the reasons.
 
I can perhaps add the following explanation to the characters' profiles:

"Can manipulate laws and/or concepts in deeper layers, which has an uncountably greater affect on reality than baseline laws and/or concepts." (The explanation would link to this CRT to give more info on the potency)
 
Last edited:
in my opinion it's fine, let's see what others say! ...
imZer0Null said:
I can perhaps add the following explanation to the characters' profiles:

"Can manipulate laws and/or concepts in deeper layers, which has an uncountably greater affect on reality than baseline laws and/or concepts." (The explanation would link to this CRT to give more info on the potency)
Click to expand...
 
Linking to forum threads as wiki explanations is definitely not ideal. Properly writtten blogs would be much preferable.
 
This blog explains how the "strength" of laws and concepts from a deep layer is at least uncountably greater than that of a shallow layer.
Would it be fine to link to this blog?
 
Last edited:
I suppose so, yes.

Unless other staff members object at least.
 
Also last question... This upgrade should not affect Anos resistance? for example since Venuzdonoa exerts a CM 3 more powerful than the baseline and Anos is practically immune to Venuzdonoa, shouldn't it improve his resistance even more against CM 3? or even not just CM 3 maybe some other things, but rn I'm just talking about CM 3 ..
 
Antvasima said:
I suppose so, yes.

Unless other staff members object at least.
Click to expand...
I'll wait to see if anyone objects. If they don't, I'll apply the changes to the profiles.

Dereck03 said:
Also last question... This upgrade should not affect Anos resistance? for example since Venuzdonoa exerts a CM 3 more powerful than the baseline and Anos is practically immune to Venuzdonoa, shouldn't it improve his resistance even more against CM 3? or even not just CM 3 maybe some other things, but rn I'm just talking about CM 3 ..
Click to expand...
I'm not sure. Since his resistance hasn't been shown to be any weaker in deeper layers, I suppose it would also get an upgrade.
 
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