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Bleach: Possible upgrade for Existance eraser ability and resistance for Ichigo

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EldemadeDityjon

EldemadeDityjon

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Aizen has Passive EE after Transcendency. It's already listed in his profile.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Sosuke Aizen

Sōsuke Aizen (藍染 惣右介, Aizen Sōsuke) is the former captain of the 5th Division in the Gotei 13. He later leaves Soul Society with his followers, Gin Ichimaru and Kaname Tōsen. His lieutenant was Momo Hinamori. He formerly served as the lieutenant of the 5th Division under Shinji Hirako. After...
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As Transcended being Ichigo should get the existance eraser and resistance for existence Eraser.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Ichigo Kurosaki (Post-Timeskip)

Ichigo Kurosaki (黒崎 一護, Kurosaki Ichigo?) is the son of Masaki Kurosaki and Isshin Kurosaki, a Quincy with the powers of a Shinigami. Years after the death of his mother, Ichigo uses his innate spiritual awareness to help local ghosts, and unlocks his potential as a Shinigami when Rukia Kuchiki...
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Transcendency is already in the Ichigo profile. Just need to upgrade EE and resistance for EE.
 
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I knew this was coming when I approved it.

As it currently stands, I am a bit neutral towards giving Ichigo resistance to EE because I honestly believe that Aizen's soul crush is more a matter of AP than it is an actual ability. However, I will approve the resistance because it is on Aizen's profile.

However, flat no to EE for Ichigo. Simply put, he lacks any feats of doing so and since we saw him fighting all-out besides Renji against Yhwach and in the vicinity of Orihime without erasing them or mentioning of that being possible. So it's also contradicted.

Edit: Not to mention just his entire fight with the Quincy before getting up to the Soul Palace.

Aizen is just unique in this regard as far as we're shown.
 
Duedate8898 said:
I knew this was coming when I approved it.

As it currently stands, I am a bit neutral towards giving Ichigo resistance to EE because I honestly believe that Aizen's soul crush is more a matter of AP than it is an actual ability. However, I will approve the resistance because it is on Aizen's profile.

However, flat no to EE for Ichigo. Simply put, he lacks any feats of doing so and since we saw him fighting all-out besides Renji against Yhwach and in the vicinity of Orihime without erasing them or mentioning of that being possible. So it's also contradicted.

Edit: Not to mention just his entire fight with the Quincy before getting up to the Soul Palace.

Aizen is just unique in this regard as far as we're shown.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the input

So resistance for EE is fine.

Can you please take a look at this if this can qualifies for EE.

 
Nope, that looks more like an Ap feat than it does existence erasure since that's just the aftermath of those two clashing.
 
Duedate8898 said:
Nope, that looks more like an Ap feat than it does existence erasure since that's just the aftermath of those two clashing.
Click to expand...

Last scan translates to mountains got erased instead destroyed.

Well if it can't be accepted as EE then fine with resistance only.
 
Oh didn't realize that's what the third page was for, when it comes to relying on Raws I normally air neutral due to my own lack of understanding of Japanese. But past that, the fact that there's a cloud of dust left over from the impact of their strikes still leaves me leaning on that being more ap than it was actual erasuer.

Speaking of EE, I do think Aizen's justification should be changed. Mainly because it isn't stated that anything comes into contact with his spiritual pressure will be erased. He specifies humans. Probably because we're shown the likes of Gin just chilling next Aizen in his new state and even after evolving, he still isn't erased just by being in the vicinity. Nor is any of the surrounding matter.
 
Duedate8898 said:
Speaking of EE, I do think Aizen's justification should be changed. Mainly because it isn't stated that anything comes into contact with his spiritual pressure will be erased. He specifies humans. Probably because we're shown the likes of Gin just chilling next Aizen in his new state and even after evolving, he still isn't erased just by being in the vicinity. Nor is any of the surrounding matter.
Click to expand...

Yeah physical material weren't got erased just souls. Physical matter just got destroyed.

Duedate8898 said:
Oh didn't realize that's what the third page was for, when it comes to relying on Raws I normally air neutral due to my own lack of understanding of Japanese. But past that, the fact that there's a cloud of dust left over from the impact of their strikes still leaves me leaning on that being more ap than it was actual erasuer.
Click to expand...

Hate to bring other verses but just show something on Naruto TSO being EE even though it creates dust in surrounding area.
Just saying. If that can be considered as EE so isn't this can be considered as EE.
 
Nightmare_Bloodfallen said:
Hate to bring other verses but just show something on Naruto TSO being EE even though it creates dust in surrounding area.
Just saying. If that can be considered as EE so isn't this can be considered as EE.
Click to expand...
Could've sworn that the environment was normally okay because it already has nature energy inside of it, which is the only way to avoid the erasing effect of TSO.
 
Imo Aizen shouldent even have EE, we’ve seen his “human killing” reaitsu be used before here and in the background you can see the human having been killed but his body parts are still remaining, so I think the “cease to exist” statement is more in reference to death in general then literally getting erased sort of death, but whatever.

Anyway the resistance I don’t really see either cus in the scan i linked above, it specifically says humans die in his presence because of there low reiatsu,
1. ichigo is not a human

2.Every instance of ichigo interacting with trancendence Aizen is dangai/mugetsu ichigo, who obviously has a higher reaitsu then normal humans.
But that’s just my take
 
I disagree with either of them having EE to begin with tbh. If aizen's aura could completely erase things far weaker than himself, how was it that isshin was able to feel the kototsu's residual energy after it got nuked by aizen? If it was truly erased there would be no residual energy.

And like Duedate said, there's dust rising from the mountain that was supposedly "erased". EE is almost always a clean process as it's not burning or vaporising anything.

Given the antifeats, I think kubo's usage of "erase" isn't the strict power-scaling version that we use but instead another way of saying that something got completely destroyed:

 
Duedate8898 said:
However, flat no to EE for Ichigo. Simply put, he lacks any feats of doing so and since we saw him fighting all-out besides Renji against Yhwach and in the vicinity of Orihime without erasing them or mentioning of that being possible. So it's also contradicted.

Edit: Not to mention just his entire fight with the Quincy before getting up to the Soul Palace.

Aizen is just unique in this regard as far as we're shown.
Click to expand...
Again another argument from ignorance, just because he hasn't physically shown the ability despite the fact he would most likely have it as i shown in my previous statement is an argument from ignorance.

He also didn't Fear Hax or Soul Hax them either, guess he doesn't have any of those abilities with his Reiatsu then because of that supposed "Contradictory Evidence". Please use actual evidence that debunks the assertion instead of some goofy ass point like that.

Another argument from ignorance.
 
catzlaflame said:
Imo Aizen shouldent even have EE, we’ve seen his “human killing” reaitsu be used before here and in the background you can see the human having been killed but his body parts are still remaining, so I think the “cease to exist” statement is more in reference to death in general then literally getting erased sort of death, but whatever.

Anyway the resistance I don’t really see either cus in the scan i linked above, it specifically says humans die in his presence because of there low reiatsu,
1. ichigo is not a human

2.Every instance of ichigo interacting with trancendence Aizen is dangai/mugetsu ichigo, who obviously has a higher reaitsu then normal humans.
But that’s just my take
Click to expand...
You do understand fiction displays different abilities differently right? Also Aizen's aura is condensed around his body at the time of that feat as shown in the scan for his Existence Erasure which is why only some parts of the human's bodies are missing while most aren't.

Have you read Bleach by any chance? you do understand he does the exact same thing to Shinigami in the TYBW Arc? and him saying Humans die in his presents doesn't cap the ability on only being able to Erase Human, He's making that statement because the beings around him at that moment are only humans, it wouldn't make sense to add-on to that statement and say "Also Soul Reapers and Hollows die as well" when there's no Shinigami (That are his Enemy) and Hollows around him at the moment.

Already inherently addressed these points in this comment and previous comments so i won't re-address them here.
 
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Deceived said:
Again another argument from ignorance, just because he hasn't physically shown the ability despite the fact he would most likely have it as i shown in my previous statement is an argument from ignorance.

He also didn't Fear Hax or Soul Hax them either, guess he doesn't have any of those abilities with his Reiatsu then because of that supposed "Contradictory Evidence". Please use actual evidence that debunks the assertion instead of some goofy ass point like that.

Another argument from ignorance.
Click to expand...
Huh, I tire of you constantly resorting to calling my conclusions arguments from ignorance. Especially in this case where my argument isn't solely that he lacks any statements or showings of EE, but that he has direct anti-feats of doing so. After Ichigo regains the power he once had, where he would be "transcendent" again, he is shown fighting multiple times. He battles several of the Sternritter, with no mentions or showing of his spiritual pressure erasing others. He battles against Yhwach briefly, once again, no showing or mentions of EE. While battling Yhwach the second time, Orihime is just fine being in his general vicinity even after he releases his spiritual pressure. And in his final battle against Yhwach, Renji is there and just ******* dandy without worry of getting erased. Ichigo had ample opportunity to show the same "existence erasure" as Aizen, but completely fails to.

He's not getting EE, simple as that.
 
Rebirth said:
I disagree with either of them having EE to begin with tbh. If aizen's aura could completely erase things far weaker than himself, how was it that isshin was able to feel the kototsu's residual energy after it got nuked by aizen? If it was truly erased there would be no residual energy.

And like Duedate said, there's dust rising from the mountain that was supposedly "erased". EE is almost always a clean process as it's not burning or vaporising anything.

Given the antifeats, I think kubo's usage of "erase" isn't the strict power-scaling version that we use but instead another way of saying that something got completely destroyed:

Click to expand...
Wrong a bottle was thrown at aizen and literally got erased. It's stated he was going to erase KKT.


Aizen used hado 90 in the ss and hisagi stated their was no trace of the debris.

Raw translation
瓦磯まで跡形も無
There is no trace of the debris.
 
Reio35 said:

Aizen used hado 90 in the ss and hisagi stated their was no trace of the debris.

Raw translation
瓦磯まで跡形も無
There is no trace of the debris.
Click to expand...
Those are actually separate to the Existence Erasure that's being argued here. Both erasing of Katakuri town is through sacrificing everyone there to become the next soul king while the use of Hado 90 isn't the same as just AIzen's passive spiritual pressure which is also shown erasing the arms of some dudes when they're trying to move him around during TYBW.
 
Duedate8898 said:
Huh, I tire of you constantly resorting to calling my conclusions arguments from ignorance. Especially in this case where my argument isn't solely that he lacks any statements or showings of EE, but that he has direct anti-feats of doing so. After Ichigo regains the power he once had, where he would be "transcendent" again, he is shown fighting multiple times. He battles several of the Sternritter, with no mentions or showing of his spiritual pressure erasing others. He battles against Yhwach briefly, once again, no showing or mentions of EE. While battling Yhwach the second time, Orihime is just fine being in his general vicinity even after he releases his spiritual pressure. And in his final battle against Yhwach, Renji is there and just ******* dandy without worry of getting erased. Ichigo had ample opportunity to show the same "existence erasure" as Aizen, but completely fails to.

He's not getting EE, simple as that.
Click to expand...
Because they're, stop making faulty arguments and i'll stop commenting about them being faulty. It isn't hard. That's is literally the entire bases of your argument and that supposed "Direct Anti-Feats" aren't actually anti-feats as i explained in my post. i'm literally just going to restate what i said in my other comment since this post doesn't actually refute the argument i made there.

"He also didn't Fear Hax or Soul Hax them either, guess he doesn't have any of those abilities with his Reiatsu then because of that supposed "Contradictory Evidence". Please use actual evidence that debunks the assertion instead of some goofy ass point like that"

I'm also going to drop the definition of what an Argument from Ignorance is so you'll stop making these types of arguments in the future.

"Argument from ignorance (from Latin: argumentum ad ignorantiam), also known as appeal to ignorance (in which ignorance represents "a lack of contrary evidence"), is a fallacy in informal logic. It asserts that a proposition is true because it has not yet been proven false or a proposition is false because it has not yet been proven true"
 
The fear hax and soul hax is stated and shown for spiritual pressure in general, consistently throughout the series. That's why Ichigo gets that, and why he's not getting EE. He lacks statements that would contribute it to him and the showings to do so.

That's my piece. If you'd like, you could try to run this by other mods, but I don't see you convincing anyone else.
 
Reio35 said:
Wrong a bottle was thrown at aizen and literally got erased. It's stated he was going to erase KKT.


Aizen used hado 90 in the ss and hisagi stated their was no trace of the debris.

Raw translation
瓦磯まで跡形も無
There is no trace of the debris.
Click to expand...
When was it confirmed that the bottle got erased from existence? Also nobody here so far has addressed the kototsu anti-feat and me and duedate pointing out the dust cloud that was formed after that mountain got destroyed which points away from true EE.
 
Deceived said:
You do understand fiction displays different abilities differently right?
Click to expand...
EE is completely erasing something from existence, it doesn’t matter how “differently” abilities are portrayed throughout fiction this standard has to be met for something to qualify It’s literally on the EE page
Existence Erasure is the simple power to remove something from existence, leaving nothing behind, a level of destruction beyond incineration, vaporization, and atomization. Rather than just reducing something to its constituent parts, this ability leaves absolutely nothing behind.
Click to expand...

Deceived said:
Also Aizen's aura is condensed around his body at the time of that feat as shown in the scan for his Existence Erasure which is why only some parts of the human's bodies are missing while most aren't.

Have you read Bleach by any chance?
Click to expand...
Ive read up to Aizen’s defeat, I have not read TYBW,
Deceived said:
you do understand he does the exact same thing to Shinigami in the TYBW Arc?
Click to expand...
Ok, send the scan.

everything else I would’ve said everyone else said, I really doubt staff will accept this.
 
Duedate8898 said:
The fear hax and soul hax is stated and shown for spiritual pressure in general, consistently throughout the series. That's why Ichigo gets that, and why he's not getting EE. He lacks statements that would contribute it to him and the showings to do so
Click to expand...
But.. But Ichigo didn't Soul Hax then nor did he Fear Hax them either which are "Direct Anti-Feats" against him having the ability, there's more instants of Ichigo not Soul Hax or Fear Haxing anyone rather then him actually Soul/Fear haxing anyone.

My entire point is that this argument is doodoo since it literally can be applied to any-verse that has inconsistent showings with abilities, despite the fact these characters most likely have these abilities because of other supplemental evidences (Which in this case would be the entire structure of Reiatsu and how abilities are derived from Reiatsu).
 
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catzlaflame said:
EE is completely erasing something from existence, it doesn’t matter how “differently” abilities are portrayed throughout fiction this standard has to be met for something to qualify It’s literally on the EE page
Click to expand...
..... Yeah Aizen does that to the specific body parts his Aura comes in contact with, that's why those body parts aren't there anymore.

catzlaflame said:
Ive read up to Aizen’s defeat, I have not read TYBW,
Click to expand...
😑😑

catzlaflame said:
Ok, send the scan.

everything else I would’ve said everyone else said, I really doubt staff will accept this.
Click to expand...
Sure here's the scan.
 
Duedate8898 said:
Could've sworn that the environment was normally okay because it already has nature energy inside of it, which is the only way to avoid the erasing effect of TSO.
Click to expand...
You got a point. So my proposal kinda changes now. Any character with low Spiritual energy gets erased from existence.

Also we have Quincies statement for erasing characters from existance



Aizen pretty much referring if anyone who doesn't have enough Spiritual touches him they would get erased from existence.

We also see stronger hollows tanking Quincy arrows but weaker hollows getting erased in an instant. It's like that kinda off a thing. So I am ok with Aizen getting EE for Spiritual beings who has lesser spiritual energy.
 
Rebirth said:
I disagree with either of them having EE to begin with tbh. If aizen's aura could completely erase things far weaker than himself, how was it that isshin was able to feel the kototsu's residual energy after it got nuked by aizen? If it was truly erased there would be no residual energy.

And like Duedate said, there's dust rising from the mountain that was supposedly "erased". EE is almost always a clean process as it's not burning or vaporising anything.

Given the antifeats, I think kubo's usage of "erase" isn't the strict power-scaling version that we use but instead another way of saying that something got completely destroyed:

Click to expand...
Physical matter and spiritual matter are different. Aizen referring to Souls getting erased from existence.

Also don't bring physical stuffs erasing as anti feat because Naruto TSO has resistance to Nature or something but it's still considering as EE. So I don't want people to having BS opinion on Bleach.
 
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Damage3245 said:
Aizen says "Any human who touches him". Not just anyone and everyone who touches him.
Click to expand...
Technically referring to weaker characters who has less spiritual energy. His Transcended Spiritual energy can erase them from existance.
Nightmare_Bloodfallen said:
You got a point. So my proposal kinda changes now. Any character with low Spiritual energy gets erased from existence.

Also we have Quincies statement for erasing characters from existance



Aizen pretty much referring if anyone who doesn't have enough Spiritual touches him they would get erased from existence.

We also see stronger hollows tanking Quincy arrows but weaker hollows getting erased in an instant. It's like that kinda off a thing. So I am ok with Aizen getting EE for Spiritual beings who has lesser spiritual energy.
Click to expand...
 
catzlaflame said:
EE is completely erasing something from existence, it doesn’t matter how “differently” abilities are portrayed throughout fiction this standard has to be met for something to qualify It’s literally on the EE page
Click to expand...
Aizen Erasing the spiritual bodies not physical things. Also Naruto TSO listed as EE even though it's only erases some things. Also Aizen referring to spiritual beings who has lesser spiritual energy gets erased from the existence. Aizen Transcended Reatsu makes them to erases from existance.
 
Nightmare_Bloodfallen said:
Physical matter and spiritual matter are different. Aizen referring to Souls getting erased from existence.

Also don't bring physical stuffs erasing as anti feat because Naruto TSO has resistance to Nature or something but it's still considering as EE. So I don't want people to having BS opinion on Bleach.
Click to expand...
The kototsu is a spiritual being, it's heavily implied by isshin that it wasn't erased from existence as he could still feel its residual spirit energy despite aizen completely destroying its entire body.

True EE = ABSOLUTELY NOTHING is left behind
 
I agree with Ichigo getting resistance. Yhwach should get it too. Neutral on Ichigo getting EE. Mainly because only Aizen shown a reiastu that strong But that because Ichigo intentionally avoid to erase people.

and for the “any human” part is because an human was charging azien, not because it works on human, in the last arc Aizen erased a shinigami while sealed.
 
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Rebirth said:
The kototsu is a spiritual being, it's heavily implied by isshin that it wasn't erased from existence as he could still feel its residual spirit energy despite aizen completely destroying its entire body.

True EE = ABSOLUTELY NOTHING is left behind
Click to expand...
Send the scans for kototsu beings Spiritual being.
 
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