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Battle of spatial user

I get inspiration for this matchup from law and dms kakashi, don't blame me
 
Seems like a good match. They can both definitely win one way or another, but I think Marin is more likely to Null Law's devil fruit and then banish him. Law can also win even with his powers nulled with any solid hit. For these reasons, I day Marin high dif
 
Marin power nulls magical abilities, Law's Devil Fruit isn't a magical ability. We don't equalize Magic and Devil Fruits, similarly to how we don't equate Haki to Magic and other Chi Groups since they work differently. From what I remember he doesn't open up with BFR, so I'd give it to Law for actually starting with his hax from the get go, having his own form of Teleportation and having durability negation. His Kenbunshoku Haki should also be a hard counter to Marin's Teleportation given its presence detection, extra sensory perception and some form of precog to know where he'll Teleportation to before he actually does it.
 
Is the ability specifically the nagation of spatial magic or just space-time manip? The profile says its space time manip in general, but I guess we will need to look at the wording of the original series
 
Spatial Magic (þ®║ÚûôÚ¡öµ│ò Kükan Mahō): Marin is a very adept user of Spatial Magic, which revolves around the manipulation of space. This Magic allows Marin to teleport himself instantaneously to any location he desires. His teleportation is so fast that neither Natsu Dragneel nor Gray Fullbuster were able to actively land a blow on him during their short bout. His Magic also grants him the ability to cancel out any Magic relating to space.


Law doesn't rely on Magic, he controls space itself and his spatial manipulation a lot more versatile and potent than what Marin has shown.
 
Anti-Spatial Aura: He can prevent any spatial-based abilities in around town range around him. It includes Teleportation, Summoning, and Banishing.


Either way, we should look a the wording of the show an not just work off interpritation
 
Yes, it's Magic based. Law's fruit isn't a magical based ability, what Marin negates is Magic. Devil Fruit effect the DNA and more of a biologically thing that gives you the abilities.
 
I know his power is magic based, but I want to know if the show says that he is explicitly only negating spatial magic or just space time manip. I am guessing its probabaly a mixed bag

Devil Fruits are also supernatural, but that is beside the point
 
Marin null spatial manipulation,his magic what allow him to null anykind of space manipulation, saying his hax only limited to his own verse is just lowball, by this logic other verse hax also limited to their verse?
 
1997KD said:
Marin null spatial manipulation,his magic what allow him to null anykind of space manipulation, saying his hax only limited to his own verse is just lowball, by this logic other verse hax also limited to their verse?
Click to expand...


False and dishonest. This is always looked at on a case by case basis, it depends on the source that Marin is attempting to negate. His negation is based on magical abilities, and for the same reason he wouldn't be able to negate Law's Spatial Manipulation due to us not equating Devil Fruits and Magic. The mechanics are very different and work much differently. It's not a low ball and it depends on the verse, as I said it's looked at on a case by case basis, similarly to how we don't equate Bleach's Reiatsu to Magic or Haki making Shinigami invisible to them on versus threads.
 
It's his magic which allows him to negate spital power, not just spatial magic, then by this logic natsu or ds can't consume the source outside their verse cause there verse use ethernano, while verse like one piece you devil fruit power and ethernanoÔëádf
 
False comparisons my dude. His magic is based around spatial manipulation and negating magic that has to do with Spatial Manipulation. His profiles even states such. And actually that's one argument I have a massive issue with but that's for another time so I won't get into the Etherano discussion but we don't equate Devil Fruits or Haki to Magic. If you have an issue with that make a CRT about it.
 
I guess should make a crt to prove the marin or any ft character power didn't work outside their verse, marin profile have power nullification not limited power nullification, they are using magic to do something(space manipulation) or stop something using their hax

it's kind like natsu where fire magic didn't work on him,but it's not like only normal fire will harm him.
20190108 152034 rmedited
 
Let me stop you right there. Why are you using the anime as a scan? The anime isn't even the main Canon, if you wanna use scans for a debate you should also use the Manga along with the Viz scans. And again your Natsu example is a false comparison, he can be burned by both magical fire and normal fire depending on how hot they are.

In the Manga Marin never states that he's in control of space, this is why you should use the Manga scans with official translations. Anime in general tend to be filled with misinformation, false translations and overall things that contradict the Manga.
 
IIRC magic is the source of natural phenomena in Fairy Tail. Lightning magic is actual lightning. Light magic is actual light. Etc. So it stands to reason that nullifying spatial abilities is just nullifying spatial phenomena.
 
12Marin
Also we don't limit his spatial nullfication because it works on spatial magic. Spatial Magic is spatial manipulation.

EDIT: And Viz doesn't translate Fairy Tail
 
That's not true either, that statement is actually pretty much goes against what it states. Light in Fairy Tail bends, Fire becomes Solid, Lightning can be red, etc. Funnily enough that's only stated once in the Manga in a statement filled with Flowery Language ( I.E Marakov saying that souls are in magic, etc. )


0442-012
0442-013
 
@HST


Again this is false. Even in the official translations done by reliable sources he doesn't state that he controls all of space but rather the area. Furthermore the most impressive Spatial Magic he's negated was Erza's re equip and Lucy's Key Magic. Both of which are no where as potent as Law's even if we accept his magic negation as being able to negate the real thing. Which is wrong goings by the scans and the content of the Manga. Magic doesn't also equate to the real thing and the Manga show cases this many times ( Fire becoming solid, light bending, ice freezing fire, fire vaporizing sand which is impossible, etc. There's a plethora of other examples. )
 
@Rin

1st, no one is imolying that he can control space no matter where in the world. It's implying he's controlling the space in the area. To boot Law has shown no resistance to getting ROOM nulled. To say that Marin can't null it because he's only nulled Erza, Lucy, and Mess is faulty. And again it's not simply magic negation. You're trying to push Marin's spatial nullification working on magic only when we have never treated an ability done by magic to only work on magic. Magic is the prime source of energy in Fairy Tail.
 
How's it faulty? That's not faulty in the slightest, you can't null something that's massively above what you've been shown to handle. That's essentially the equivalent of me arguing that Character A can mind hax character B whenever character B can handle mind hax that controls millions while character A can only control one. It doesn't work like that, Law's spatial Manipulation is much more potent than anything Marin has been able to negate. And again, every time he's done this he's explained that he's negating the spatial based magic. Having control of spatial magic doesn't allow you to control space itself, you're doing it via that magic. And again this is all assuming that we equalize Devil Fruits to Magic which we don't. Furthermore Law's Room isn't spatial, ROOM simply allows him to use his spatial hax like his spatial slicing and his other hax. And actually we have treated it that way before with other verses. Mainly such as Genjutsu that's not ocular being unable to work on people without a Chakra system.
 
False Equivalency. This is someone who uses Spatial Manipulation vs Someone who's ability is to null it. It's not NLF because it isn't something on the scale of Palkia. He's explained he's negating the spatial based magic because besides Curses, Magic is the only source in the verse. It's like saying someone in Naruto can only nullify jutsus and not have power null in general. And again we aren't equalizing anything. ROOM is a spatial ability. Marin's Magic nulls spatial abilities while he's around and bfrs the person who violates this rule automatically. And we have never limited Genjutsu that isn't occular because of a chakra system.

EDIT: And yes ROOM is a spatial ability, due to him creating a space to further use his powers.
 
Again you fail to see. Law's spatial manipulation is far above what Marin has been shown to negate, Funnily enough he's never even negated a spatial attack that negates durability. Once he does then we can talk about him possibly negating Law's spacial slashing. And no ROOM itself isn't a spatial ability, ROOM is what let's him use his spatial abilities, to which he wouldn't be able to negate due to not having feats on that level. He's a 7-A attempting to negate a spatial attack that works on a 6-C level and makes what he's negated look like Fodder. Law's spatial manipulation is massively above that of Erza's Magic and Lucy's Magic. And we have if you actually ever read any One Piece vs Naruto threads that come into The Genjutsu since it works by manipulating an energy which doesn't exist in One Piece or be equalized to. Marin isn't gonna be negating Law's Spatial Hax for multiple reasons.


1: Law's spatial manipulation is much, much, much more potent and versatile than what Marin has been shown to negate or even use. Marin has never negated a spacial based attack that ignores durability or works like Law's can. Matter of fact, Law's Spatial Manipulation can work on those who are resistant to spatial manipulation. (I.E Vergo who's Busushoko Haki was negating Law's durability negation. Law gets out of trouble and slashes him apart whenever Vergo was previously resistant to it. Furthermore Haki actually negates Devil Fruit abilities and Law's hax still worked on him. ) so either way you look at it Marin isn't gonna be able to negate Law's spatial hax due to working on a much higher scale than Marin's or what Marin has ever been shown to be able to negate.


2: Law simply breaths and Marin dies due to the AP gap. Law is 6-C to Marin's 7-A. As far as I'm concerned all Law needs to do is literally breath and Marin is done for, that's ignoring the many ways Law has to end this.


3: This is just a simple bonus which furthers that Marin can't do anything here. Law's attacks reach and hit the opponent without much effort. It's nigh instantaneous along with the fact that's its invisible, Marin has no prior knowledge that Law is actually using Spatial hax due to him never seeing it used in this fashion. He'd need to figure out what Law's attack is using and that's not happening before Law cuts him up and attaches his body to objects, stopping Marin from using his magic. We've seen that this causes a massive amount of panic and confusion in the opponent and last i remember Marin's magic isn't thought based. So take either of these scenarios, Law stomps here.
 
A. Being a tier higher doesn't make your Spatial Manipulation immune to being power nulled if you showed zero resistance. That said if there were upgrades they haven't been applied yet btw.

B. Yes ROOM is a spatial ability. ROOM creates a space so he can use his other abilities. Creating a space is spatial manipulation. It is therefore a spatial ability. And Marin isn't resistant to Spatial Manip, he simply nulls it while he's in the area.

C. Cool, Rules of The Area BFRs anyone that tries to use spatial manipulation while Marin is in the area.
 
Nice just wrote a massive paragraph as to how and why Marin can't negate it and you essentially just say "No U."


1: That's not the reason why, Law's Spatial Manipulation is objectively much more potent than anything Marin has been shown to be capable of negating. His best feats when it comes to negating spatial manipulation ( To which I doubt he can even negate in the first place seeing as how he isn't manipulating space itself, nor does Erza and Lucy attack with Spatial hax. They have minor spatial manipulation in the sense that they swap armor from a different sub space and such. ) all Marin has done is negate Fodder level spatial manipulation that can't even be used for combat. Meaning Law's spatial manipulation works on a much more devastating level than anything he's been shown to negate, works on those with resistance to spatial manipulation and work on Vergo despite his Haki negating his spatial hax in a similar fashion to how Doffy did. Hell it even worked on Doffy himself a few times through out Dressrosa.


2: ROOM is the ability that gives him spatial manipulation, he creates a sphere around him that gives him control over space. And if we're going this route I can just as easily say Law can stop any spacial shanagagins Marin uses since Law is in full control of the space around him which has a massive area of effect.


3: Cool, Law switches himself with Marin before that happens. Which isn't even needed because as soon as Law speaks Marin does due to the AP advantage. Even given that scenario, Law's attack would reach him first and incapacitate him and once Law gets BFR'd then it'll end as an inconclusive since Marin would still be incapable of even doing anything meanwhile Law is just somewhere else, although he could simply just his own swapping in conjunction with his Kenbunshoku Haki. Worst comes to worst Law can just switch bodies with Marin while it happens. Leaving Law's mind in Marin's body and Marin's mind on Law's body and Marin is the one who gets the begone thot treatment.
 
Law FRA... Don't act like Marin is going to full on know Law's Ope-Ope abilities right off the bat. The second Law throws a sword swing that connects, it's over.

The "magic-null" argument is ridiculous. Law doesn't use magic.

The arguments brought for Marin ignore all context on the FT profiles (ESPECIALLY for Erza), and are outright the result of favoritism.
 
1. No you're paragraph was essentially saying he cannot negate it because he attacks with Spatial Manip and has a higher ap. That said surprisingly I looked back and not only did it work on Freed's Jutsushiki Barrier around Magnolia and Erza's Requip again while Far away from her at Lucy's House while shrunk by Brandish, it nulled Jacob Lessio's Transport and Stealth Magic when copied by Gemini, Gemini can only copy those close to or weaker than itself.

2. I know ROOMs range, but the fact that Law wouldn't even know Rules of The Area was activated counters this, alongside Marin tending to use it immediately. ROOM wouldn't even have a chance to activate.

3. > Law switches himself with Marin

Rules Of The Area doesn't simply let the target use their Spatial Manip and BFRs them for using it. It nulls spatial manipulation in the area period and if you still try to use it, you get BFR'd to another dimension. And I recall Law leads with ROOM.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Law FRA... Don't act like Marin is going to full on know Law's Ope-Ope abilities right off the bat. The second Law throws a sword swing that connects, it's over.

The "magic-null" argument is ridiculous. Law doesn't use magic.

The arguments brought for Marin ignore all context on the FT profiles (ESPECIALLY for Erza), and are outright the result of favoritism.
Click to expand...
Never said Law uses Magic. In fact I said that saying Marin's Ability only works on Magic is faulty. And how is it favortism and ignoring context?
 
1: And again, all of their spatial manipulation isn't as impressive as Law's. Freed's magic is hardly spatial manipulation, he uses a lot more than just spatial manipulation so that argument is faulty in of itself. And again I'll bring this up, saying that Marin controls space itself is faulty and incorrect. His magic is what manipulates space, not Marin himself. Furthermore, Law isn't using magic to manipulate space. Law manipulates space itself unlike where with the people who's spatial manipulation Marin's negated can't control space without their magic. For the sole reason that they need to use magic in order to do so. In other words Marin can't negate non Magic based spatial manipulation.


2:Wank. This is under the assumption that Marin would even know that Law is using spatial manipulation, which he wouldn't. And he doesn't start out with his BFR as seen with Erza and Lucy, meanwhile Law opens ROOM, slashes and boom. It's over before Marin does anything due to his attacks hitting you instantaneously. Marin doesn't know that Law is using spatial manipulation and again I have issues with saying that Marin negates space itself whenever in every chapter he's been in and negates magic he's included "I've negated that spacial magic." this is similar to that of Yamamoto's spatial slashing where it can cut space but he isn't controlling space itself.


3:His mind swapping has nothing to do with Spatial Manipulation you are aware of this correct? Law leads with ROOM yes but it's up to Marin to even realize it's Spatial Manipulation, try to banish Law meanwhile Law would simply just use his mind switching to get himself out of the situation. His BFR isn't instant and took a decent amount of time, time in which Law could just point his sword at Marin and swap bodies.
 
0002-022
and before anyone gives me the FT Magic is the same thing as real elements argument that's not the official translation. The official translation reads this, as you can see it's much different. It's never stated that if you use magic you're using the actual thing. I'm actually gonna have to make a massive CRT revolving around this soon so I'll end this part of the argument here.
 
Can you do that first? The speed for the characters leading up to Alvarez Arc comes from the fact that Laxus's lightning is treated as real lightning. What's accepted right now is that the magic is the real thing. Arguing that it's not and then taking votes with that line of thinking can't happen until that replaces what's currently accepted.
 
I'm actually going to bed soon so I can't unfortunately. I'll try to post it after I wake up but it'll take awhile solely because of the amount of content I'd need to cover.
 
1. It's faulty because his magic has more applications than simply spatial manipulation? What? Also again Marin using Magic doesn't disprove his ability to negate spatial manipulation. Magic isn't thrown in a entirely other category from manipulation.

2. Wank how? Marin starts off with Rules of The Area regardless of if he knows his opponents are Spatial Manipulation users or not. He immediately uses it. Proof in the pudding is his 1st appearance. He didn't let them use their magic and then nulled it, he already had it activated. And his BFR isn't separate, it's a byproduct of attempting to use spatial manipulation while Rules of The Area is activated.

3. Shambles is activated via ROOM. No ROOM = No Shambles. And refer to number 2.
 
1: Freed's magic isn't just spatial manipulation, it's a mixture of various magic. Not necessarily something that can be used as an argument, meanwhile Law's spatial hax has much more feats such as bypassing resistance to spatial manipulation and bypassing Haki that negates Devil Fruit abilities. He's done it with Vergo in the past and the same thing worked on Doffy when he had the chance. Marin isn't negating Law's spatial manipulation for this reason on top of various other reasons.


2: It's wank because Marin isn't gonna be able to negate Law's spatial manipulation which is above anything he's ever done or is even capable of. Furthermore the Magic = The Real thing argument is outdated since it uses a old scan that's mistranslated. It's wank for various reasons which I've already stated. At this point arguing is gonna be redundant since you aren't giving up on your views and that fact that the argument your using isn't valid anymore.


3: He doesn't use shambles to switch bodies.

Anyway heading to bed now.
 
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