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Battle for top 1 strongest non-smurf low 2C

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And yes he could negate that through nonexistent physiology type 2 and Transduality type 2.

Transduality type 2 would negate passive power nullification that is not higher than 4D+ basically 5D
 
Sertrous is not a smurf. since Sertrous would need to have teir 1 powers or resistances to be a smurf. as well the power nullification does work on people nonexistent physiology type 2. though the Transduality might be an issue.

Also you might want to ask some of knowledgeable people on D&D for input. since they would know about Sertrous then I do.
 
Dragonstitch said:
Sertrous is not a smurf. since Sertrous would need to have teir 1 powers or resistances to be a smurf. as well the power nullification does work on people nonexistent physiology type 2. though the Transduality might be an issue.

Also you might want to ask some of knowledgeable people on D&D for input. since they would know about Sertrous then I do.
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A smurf is classified as any characters with abilities above their tiers such as a character that is 9B having 2A range.

And yes Transduality is a huge problem along with wukong's unique chaos manipulation.
 
Greatsage13th said:
A smurf is classified as any characters with abilities above their tiers such as a character that is 9B having 2A range.

And yes Transduality is a huge problem along with wukong's unique chaos manipulation.
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A smurf Power is classified as a being with power higher than their own dimension. Sertous is a 4-D being with 4-D power so he’s not a smurf
 
Sertrous isn't a smurf. I famously dislike these types of matches so I'll be brief:

2-A power null works on divine beings. If Sun is a divine being (assuming he is, given the key's name) then none of his shit works.

His passive Chaos Manip causes the universe to be absorbed into the Abyss. The Abyss is a 2-A living structure that actively buffs Sertrous.

His corruption should essentially instantly turn Sun into a pawn of Sertrous, as it did for Avamerin. This would spell out an instant win.

I don't believe Transduality Type 2 is an issue given that we are aware of multiple gods with such Transduality (Brahman, for example) and Demon Lords can fight them just fine. Sertrous would be doubly capable of doing so, given that he's an Elder Evil, the anathema to the gods.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
Sertrous isn't a smurf. I famously dislike these types of matches so I'll be brief:

2-A power null works on divine beings. If Sun is a divine being (assuming he is, given the key's name) then none of his shit works.

His passive Chaos Manip causes the universe to be absorbed into the Abyss. The Abyss is a 2-A living structure that actively buffs Sertrous.

His corruption should essentially instantly turn Sun into a pawn of Sertrous, as it did for Avamerin. This would spell out an instant win.

I don't believe Transduality Type 2 is an issue given that we are aware of multiple gods with such Transduality (Brahman, for example) and Demon Lords can fight them just fine. Sertrous would be doubly capable of doing so, given that he's an Elder Evil, the anathema to the gods.
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Wukong transcends the entirety of the Dual Systems not just becoming one with it.

And you can only fully negate the dual system by being a 5D being not just by having 2A haxes against a low 2C since both are still in the same ballpark but at a higher level.

Also for corruption and powernull.

Corruption is not going to work as Wukong's mind is virtually non-existent beyond the conceptual level.

Powernulling for divine beings is useless as Guan-Yin specically states that they are classified as "Non-beings"

As for sertrous' passive chaos manipulation that is a no brainer with wukong's 4D+ Transduality type 2 and nonexistent physiology type 2. He might also do one better by virtually warping the endless dualities to cause chaos throughout while causing all of sertrous' abilities to backlash.
 
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I'm aware of what Transduality Type 2 is.

That's not what I said. I said that Sertrous does these things to other 4-D beings who also have the same ability you're describing for Sun Wukong. You're arguing "HE CAN ONLY BE AFFECTED BY A 5-D" when there are other means of doing so.

See above.

Good thing Sertrous and scaleable creatures are A. doing this on concepts, as they themselves are concepts made manifest, and B. are capable of affecting totally nonexistent beings. Shar, for example.

Nonexistent physiology doesn't matter, see above.

See everything above. Read my words, homie.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
I'm aware of what Transduality Type 2 is.

That's not what I said. I said that Sertrous does these things to other 4-D beings who also have the same ability you're describing for Sun Wukong. You're arguing "HE CAN ONLY BE AFFECTED BY A 5-D" when there are other means of doing so.

See above.

Good thing Sertrous and scaleable creatures are A. doing this on concepts, as they themselves are concepts made manifest, and B. are capable of affecting totally nonexistent beings. Shar, for example.

Nonexistent physiology doesn't matter, see above.

See everything above. Read my words, homie.
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As far as I'm concern he doesn't have any ways of countering the dual system because he needs to use a neutral value between 1 and 0 to negate them.

And what I said is that to negate the 4D+ dual system with attacks that has values of 1 and 0 is to be higher Dimensional and yes there are other methods but it might not be as simple.

As for the last arguement. Yes they affect concepts but wukong is non-existent beyond the conceptual level which in simpler terms means he possesses no concept or Duality is bound to him because he transcended them all with scaling to Buddha and it is amplified by transduality type 2 as that level of nonexistence is still a part of the dual system and wukong transcended these levels which makes it harder to fully interact with him as well as transcending the laws of cause and effect.
 
Greatsage13th said:
And what I said is that to negate the 4D+ dual system with attacks that has values of 1 and 0 is to be higher Dimensional and yes there are other methods but it might not be as simple.
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I think it was agreed that abilities like conceptual manipulation type 2 would bypass Tranduality type 2.

I kind of leaning that match would be a stomp for Bambu's reasons.
 
Elizhaa said:
I think it was agreed that abilities like conceptual manipulation type 2 would bypass Tranduality type 2.

I kind of leaning that match would be a stomp for Bambu's reasons.
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Transduality is defined as an ability that transcends Dualities and these dualities are classified as concepts/laws that has oppositions of the value 1 and 0.

And it's more of a stomp for wukong since wukong lacks a concept bound to him as he is classified as a Non-beings but however he transcends this one step further with transduality which makes it harder for sertrous interact with him. Also wukong's transduality is 4D+ compared to sertrous' 4D
 
And no you can't affect anything that no longer possesses a concept with a concept. That's just breaking logic.
 
I am going to vote inconclusive here.
Since by the information given Sertous' Power null would work on Sun Wukong since it works on people with Nonexistent physiology, and Transduality Type 2. Meaning none of Sun Wukong's powers will work, and Sun Wukong has no way of bypassing Sertous' mid godly regeneration.
 
"And it's more of a stomp for wukong since wukong lacks a concept bound to him as he is classified as a Non-beings but however he transcends this one step further with transduality which makes it harder for sertrous interact with him. Also wukong's transduality is 4D+ compared to sertrous' 4D"

Homie have you read anything I've typed. Sertrous, as well as any other creature in D&D, has feats of affecting Type 2 Nonexistents. As in, they lack a conceptual existence. Shar is the primary example of this. Sertrous can affect Sun Wukong. I have no idea what "4D+" means, since it's not a term recognized on this wiki.

My vote is obviously for Sertrous, which makes the current vote (edited as an update) count the following:

Sertrous: 4 (Elizhaa, 00potato, Mr. Bambu, Dragonstitch)

Sun Wukong: 0

Inconclusive: 0
 
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yeah I am going to change to voting for Sertrous. since re-reading my reasoning that is clearly I was thinking Sertrous would since Sun Wukong has no way of really beating Sertrous. I have no clue why I put inconclusive.
 
Wukong clearly has the upper edge in resistances to all of sertrous' hax as they are part of the dual system so saying this is incon makes more sense then saying either side wins.
 
Greatsage13th said:
Wukong clearly has the upper edge in resistances to all of sertrous' hax as they are part of the dual system so saying this is incon makes more sense then saying either side wins.
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No he doesn't. Read my words, I beg you.
 
Greatsage13th said:
Wukong clearly has the upper edge in resistances to all of sertrous' hax as they are part of the dual system so saying this is incon makes more sense then saying either side wins.
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He does not. If you bothered to read what Mr.Bambu has said you would know sertrous' hax work on beings with the same Transduality Type 2 as Wukong. so that does not help Wukong.
 
Brahman. D&D has a deity of Transduality. Sertrous can affect him just fine. I said this above. I really wish you'd read what I was saying.
 
there isn't a profile for brahman for this wiki so as far as I have to believe your words. give me proof of Brahman's transduality please ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ༼

at least a link to the text or statement or feat that shows it.
 
Can't be arsed to track down Brahman's source since I haven't got that particular book, and finding books from the 80s-90s is a pain in the ass, so have some Aztec transcending-all-dualities deity goodies.

Here we see a god that is the personification of duality and transcendent of the mortal realm, a god who is simultaneously Space and Time and every other dual system all at the same time. He's the "in-between" of each system. I would go track down Brahma as well, but I'd like to pull attention to another post I suspect you've been ignoring.

"I think it was agreed that abilities like conceptual manipulation type 2 would bypass Tranduality type 2."
-Elizhaa

Sertrous has it. So like. Yeah.
 
This thread was a trip.
*A link to 1d4chan of all websites
*Wacky scaling for each
*The whole fight is a worm vs a monke
*The last post and major piece of evidence is the D&D description of the Aztec Pantheon of all things.
 
00potato said:
This thread was a trip.
*A link to 1d4chan of all websites
*Wacky scaling for each
*The whole fight is a worm vs a monke
*The last post and major piece of evidence is the D&D description of the Aztec Pantheon of all things.
Click to expand...
never doubt the power of 1d4chan. shitheads know their stuff, though Forgotten Realms wiki is generally better as they list extensive sources even for minor things.

also technically Sertrous is a snake... thing.

Anywho, if Wukong no longer exists, I'll be closing this. Cheers.
 
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