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A new rule proposal in lieu of some semi-recent CRTs I've seen

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So, I've been noticing a disturbing trend relating to Rooster Teeth's Death Battle. Namely, revisions that seem to have been made solely to prove it incorrect.

For example, here's an order of events:

May 17th, 2021: Po vs Iron Fist comes out on YouTube. That very same day, a Content Revision Thread is made to buff Iron Fist to Marvel Semiherald level, which at the time was 5-A (Enough to let Iron Fist one shot Po). It also was clearly created in direct response to Death Battle, and was directly created with the purpose of proving it wrong. "...the new Death Battle got released and it's downplaying as fuck as usual...".

Despite it using "The character holds back so scaling is fine" logic, something that has been constantly debunked as the means to upgrade various characters from both Marvel and DC, and it was rushed through. The revision was approved and added just two days later.

The revision was very clearly made out of spite, yet it got through in just two days. I guarantee this would never have happened in such a short amount of time, had it not been for Danny's loss.

Now, because if there is a god they're a trickster, Semiheralds were later downgraded High 6-C, making Danny once again weaker than Po's peak of 6-B, but this is ultimately irrelevant to the current discussion.

Now, we come to October 25th, 2021. DIO vs Alucard comes out on YouTube. And once again, the same day, a Content Revision Thread comes out with the purpose of upgrading Alucard to City Block level, enough to one shot DIO and let him tank all of his attacks, negating the episode's arguments by our statistics, when it was correct before. Now, this revision has yet to go through, but it also hasn't been expressly rejected.

And I feel like I do NOT need to mention what was happening, and can be argued to still be happening, after Ben Tennyson vs Hal Jordan's release.

And, frankly, there's probably other revisions I don't know about that have been made solely to spite Death Battle. After all, this community sometimes seems to be outright hateful towards this show. Such as a versus thread for Meta vs Carolina, where Meta won via hax, and then a FRA train, despite his only "hax" being a relatively out-of-character time stop. Made only a little under three months after the episode was released. Of course, I brought up these grievances and had it removed from both's profiles some time ago, but the fact it exists at all is telling.

Now, good things have come from characters appearing on Death Battle. The quality of Lucy's profile has skyrocketed since her fight against Carnage on the show. However, I think steps should be put in place to prevent these spite threads from occurring, and more importantly to prevent them from being passed so easily. So, I have made a proposition for some rules that might be a good idea to add:

  1. Within a month of a Death Battle episode's release, Content Revision Threads should not be allowed that would place a the loser of that episode's statistics above the winner's unless any of these statistics were already above the winner's.
  2. Inversely, within a month of a Death Battle's release, Content Revision Threads should not be allowed that would place the winner of that episode's statistics below the loser's unless any of those statistics were already below the loser's.
  3. An exception to the above rules will be made if the Revision is based on content that was released after the episode's release.
  4. Revisions to Powers & Abilities are unrestricted, but if it is clear that the revision is being made solely out of spite for the Death Battle episode, it will not be allowed within a month after the episode's release.
  5. Versus Threads using both characters in a Death Battle episode released less than a month ago should not be allowed, even if the thread is using other keys or incarnations of the characters.
After a month, hopefully any "Hype train" to prove an episode wrong should have dissipated to a great enough extent that a thread will only pass if it would normally pass. Although some may feel adding rules like this relating to a web series is unnecessary, but I would disagree.

It's not unreasonable to say that Death Battle is the single most influential thing in all versus debating. And while it's influence can be positive (Such as with the reworking of Lucy's profile), I would like to prevent the potentially negative influence of the show where possible.

Spite is quite possibly the single most powerful human motivator that exists in the short term, and I would like to prevent it from influencing this website in any way possible.

I would also like to note that I have nothing against the creators of the threads I've used as examples. One in particular I personally know on the wiki. I'm simply pointing out a disturbing trend and how we might fix it.
 
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This isn't a particularly harmful trend. Like, if a character's stats are accurate, the revision would be rejected anyway. There's no reason to be up in arms about this.
It's REALLY hard to say Iron Fist's sudden buff isn't just a little bit fishy, though.
 

Starter_Pack

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Agreed with Ovens and Demon wholeheartedly.

Heck, you said it yourself, having Death Battles done for characters tend to have more attention drawn to them, and hence cause more of a need to have higher quality profiles for said characters.

Restricting both versus debates and content revisions whenever these videos come out not only kills any motivation to add said quality, but also feels frankly unnecessary. Typically, spite threads are caught pretty quickly and axed, and verse supporters don't tend to be so temperamental about stuff like that. There are exceptions to this rule, but exceptions they be regardless.
 
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I suppose you have a good point. But I do think we should be more cautious of these types of threads.
 

Agnaa

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Such a rule is completely unnecessary. If the CRT is incorrect, demonstrate that and reject it. If you find Iron Fist's buff "fishy", then argue against it. Don't make a rule like this to lazily dismiss revisions like that.
 

Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer

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Restricting both versus debates and content revisions whenever these videos come out not only kills any motivation to add said quality, but also feels frankly unnecessary. Typically, spite threads are caught pretty quickly and axed, and verse supporters don't tend to be so temperamental about stuff like that. There are exceptions to this rule, but exceptions they be regardless.
Very true. Hop agrees. Restriction of speech based of current trends or what-have-you is petty and ignorant, we as a community literally have all we need to prevent the boogie-man that is the "Spite-Thread-In-The-Wake-Of-An-Animation-That-Really-Didn't-Matter-Anyway" situation. Really, the worst of it was probably Goku vs Superman, and that's just in the past at this point.
 
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the boogie-man that is the "Spite-Thread-In-The-Wake-Of-An-Animation-That-Really-Didn't-Matter-Anyway" situation.
With all due respect, it's not a boogie man. It literally happened. More than once. Even Ant himself pointed out that Danny had less Semiherald evidence than Spider-Man. And Meta vs Carolina, while it can be argued to be an example of the issues of FRAs in general rather than spite, still feels like it was spiteful against Death Battle.

And it would be ignorant to believe that all CRTs that have gone through should have gone through. It's ignorant to believe that we have a perfect staff who will always prevent spite revisions from happening. And expecting such a thing would be unreasonable. I mean, it was a staff member who created that spiteful Iron Fist buff to begin with, that even the thread itself said it was doing directly because of the Death Battle "Downplaying" Danny.

Perhaps the rules I proposed are too extreme. I went out of my way to try and ensure that as many types of CRTs as possible are still allowed, so long as it's not a spite thread to make the outcome of the episode incorrect. But I can see why it may be extreme to ban some types of threads altogether. But I think we should tread more carefully with these types of threads.
 

Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer

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Even Ant himself pointed out that Danny had less Semiherald evidence than Spider-Man. And Meta vs Carolina, while it can be argued to be an example of the issues of FRAs in general rather than spite, still feels like it was spiteful against Death Battle.

And it would be ignorant to believe that all CRTs that have gone through should have gone through. It's ignorant to believe that we have a perfect staff who will always prevent spite revisions from happening.
Then the issue isn't anything except the maturity of the users here, which the staff isn't even remotely expected to be accountable for.

We already know about those that spite vote. They know who they are and they should know that any Wins/Loses as a result of a personal disagreement with a fricking company's interpretation of another company's IP in a VS match is just that, their opinion. Spreading it on a wiki like ours happens on other wikis. Do we get defensive with such rules and slam each and every instance of it?

Ethically we should, duh, realistically, we know we f***ing can't, even with twice as many staff, being twice as active than usual. This is a popular wiki, other wikis like us are also popular. Look at DB's views. This is a popular concept in fandoms and its become its own community millions large. What you ask isn't unreasonable, but to Hop, unrealistic to uphold forever with the current imbalance of people here. Hiring more won't fix it, it'll likely grow as time goes on, as nerd culture integrates with the rest of the world via movies and TV shows about anime and comic characters on the rise.
 

Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer

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It just means we have to be careful with any CRTs that pop up shortly after a Death Battle video drops.

That's literally it. No extra rules or anything.
Exactly the point. We need no increase in staff, or staff readiness. Just awareness. Death Battle does half the hard work and they announce who's fighting and when they're gonna launch a video. It's a simple task to wait and be observant. No more work than we already put in, honestly.
 

azontr

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Yeah, just gonna regurgitate what everyone else said, this rule is completely unneeded. What if the person making the CRT doesn't even know about DB? How can you tell the purpose of the CRT was to spite DB lest it is blatantly poorly made? This seems like a really blatant attempt to pander to a specific group of people.
 

Vietthai96

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i failed to see any point in doing this, i mean this is a debating and indexing platform, while should me we too many tiny rule like this. Everyday many people already want to make revision to change the profile into what they want, in the way they interpreted those characters; this is not that much different, why should we need to care about Death Battle. On one hand, if they make a CRT out of spite, we just need to counter them, on the other hand, for some reason they make a good quality CRT, it will contribute more to the accuracy of out wiki.

Also make too many tiny rule like this will just drive people away from our wiki and make it unfriendly. So i disagree
 

Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer

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This is nearly unanimous in staff opinion. Given this has been discussed for a few days with noticeable mod and admin backlash, Hop feels it is time to close this discussion. There is no room to beat a dead horse when we have better things to do with our time.
 

The_Impress

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May 17th, 2021: Po vs Iron Fist comes out on YouTube. That very same day, a Content Revision Thread is made to buff Iron Fist to Marvel Semiherald level, which at the time was 5-A (Enough to let Iron Fist one shot Po). It also was clearly created in direct response to Death Battle, and was directly created with the purpose of proving it wrong. "...the new Death Battle got released and it's downplaying as fuck as usual...".

Despite it using "The character holds back so scaling is fine" logic, something that has been constantly debunked as the means to upgrade various characters from both Marvel and DC, and it was rushed through. The revision was approved and added just two days later.

The revision was very clearly made out of spite, yet it got through in just two days. I guarantee this would never have happened in such a short amount of time, had it not been for Danny's loss.

Now, because if there is a god they're a trickster, Semiheralds were later downgraded High 6-C, making Danny once again weaker than Po's peak of 6-B, but this is ultimately irrelevant to the current discussion.
I'll elaborate rq on this because this is my own revision being labelled as "pure spite".

I made an Iron Fist revision literally a week prior, adding a bajillion different abilities, and it was passed in essentially a day. In fact most single character Marvel CRTs pass in a few days or so since I contact staff members and ask them input over on Discord.

In general the claim "characters hold back so its fine" has never been relevantly debunked in upgrade terms, we're literally working on Herald upgrades coming from this logic, and only real spite was Death Battle fans who have NEVER ONCE inputted on a comics CRT, straight up admitting they haven't relevantly read comics in the past as well, suddenly coming out of the woodworks to protest the CRT, and their points got debunked, while mine never were. Hence they got added.

Also you recognise I am also the person who later downgraded Iron Fist and in fact most of Marvel to High 6-C? If I cared that much about the Death Battle I wouldn't have made that revision to begin with.

The thread had pushback, the thread had said pushback resolved, the thread reached a resolution. There is nothing out of the ordinary about that thread in the slightest.
 
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