A Boy is found guilty (Chris (Tyler and Chris Adventures) vs Judgement (Helltaker)) 0-0-3 (Grace)

[Board3659]

Story: Chris is in New york city in Central Park when he noticed a weird large machine. He climbs and enters it thinking it was a large treadmill recently built not realizing he was trespassing into Judgement's Sin machine

Chris vs Judgement

High 8-C vs 8-B

Range/Location: Inside of the Sin machine / 30 meters apart
All optional equipment allowed except for Sydney Shield
Speed equalized

Stats:
AP: 7 tons vs 22.821 tons
Durability: 7 tons vs 0.74 tons
So: One-shots vs AP 3.26 times Chris durability
Speed: Equal with Judgement Attack speed at Mach 3.5 while Chris's Reaction speed is at Mach 0.7 b/c it's 2x the normal speed
Skill: Around the same tbh


It's MenjivCE time!!!: 0

IGNITE THE SIN MACHINE! SUFFERING MUST BE MADE!: 0

Just push the battle somewhere else!: 3

Sorry if this is a bad stomp, I think it's not but let's see

 

[LaserPrecision]

Did you mean equalized combat speed? Judgements combat/reaction speed is different from her attack speed. Her attack speed is equivalent to a supersonic characters with a light speed laser.

 

[Board3659]

Did you mean equalized combat speed? Judgements combat/reaction speed is different from her attack speed. Her attack speed is equivalent to a supersonic characters with a light speed laser.

combat speed yes is equal to subsonic ... her attack speed is well mach 3.5

 

[LaserPrecision]

Ah, okay, so she's still got an advantage of an attack speed greater than the two's combat speed. When I get on pc, I'll look through the profiles and comment

 

[Board3659]

Ah, okay, so she's still got an advantage of an attack speed greater than the two's combat speed. When I get on pc, I'll look through the profiles and comment

I'll add more specifics ok to make it not as confusing

 

[Board3659]

bump

 

[LaserPrecision]

Just to get a little dialouge going, do they have any counter to the chains melting the flesh from his bones instantly? Or any way around being restrained by chains? If he does, he's got a way around her opening move against an opponent.

 

[Board3659]

Just to get a little dialouge going, do they have any counter to the chains melting the flesh from his bones instantly? Or any way around being restrained by chains? If he does, he's got a way around her opening move against an opponent.

um no but he doesn't get one shot and have High mid regen

they only need to survive .72 seconds though to then use Oh reliant to burn Judgement immediately which should One shot

Again Judgement AP/Chris Durability is like 3.26x while Chris AP/Judgement's Durability is one shot (more than 7 times)

Also Chris can revive as a zombie so that helps his chances of surviving long enough

This is basically if Chris can survive .72 seconds of Judgement's Danmaku chains or not

 

[LaserPrecision]

um no but he doesn't get one shot and have High mid regen

they only need to survive .72 seconds though to then use Oh reliant to burn Judgement immediately which should One shot

Again Judgement AP/Chris Durability is like 3.26x while Chris AP/Judgement's Durability is one shot (more than 7 times)

Also Chris can revive as a zombie so that helps his chances of surviving long enough

This is basically if Chris can survive .72 seconds of Judgement's Danmaku chains or not

Oh reliant is the weapon that fires fire, right? Judgement has a resistance to fire, I think she'd be fine unless the heat from Oh Reliant is like crazy hot. .72 seconds is also a pretty long charge-up time for subsonic character's. It's not an eternity of course, but in that time, Judgement could easily restrain them with her chains as well as his weapon.

 

[Board3659]

Oh reliant is the weapon that fires fire, right? Judgement has a resistance to fire, I think she'd be fine unless the heat from Oh Reliant is like crazy hot. .72 seconds is also a pretty long charge-up time for subsonic character's. It's not an eternity of course, but in that time, Judgement could easily restrain them with her chains as well as his weapon.

well how will she?

She needs to either take it which won't work b/c his supernatural luck will make it nearly impossible for an range attack (spawning chains ON him will just trap him not nessecarly take it from him) or trap him but won't he just have the AP to break out and use it regardless (Plus it assumes she even thinks it's a weapon since it looks like a pencil)

oh the fire minimum is like 1,100 C but it can gain energy from the air and other objects including the chains Judgements throws so it likley will increase much more than that (ig around 3,500 C considering it's in the sin machine and her chains have fire with them)

Also the weapon basically makes her chains lose kinetic energy (it has energy manipulation) so they won't hurt Chris as much anymore so even if he can't harm her with it, he basically disabled her only attack and can try to CQC her

 

[LaserPrecision]

well how will she?

She needs to either take it which won't work b/c his supernatural luck will make it nearly impossible for an range attack (spawning chains ON him will just trap him not nessecarly take it from him) or trap him but won't he just have the AP to break out and use it regardless (Plus it assumes she even thinks it's a weapon since it looks like a pencil)

The luck didn't seem all that potent. Just let him never get in a bus accident (The chances of never getting in one while not optimal is fairly high). While this is an anecdote, I myself have never been in an bus accident throughout all my years of schooling. It'd be a different case if the luck made a machine gun miss every shot or smth, but just never getting in a bus accident? That's not very potent luck. Judgement should be able to hit him pretty easily.
(I meant if she spawned a chain onto the oh reliant)

but won't he just have the AP to break out and use it regardless (Plus it assumes she even thinks it's a weapon since it looks like a pencil)

Given the chains are City Block level and you need to break out of it based on LS and not AP (Unless you have a concussive aura like in Dragon Ball), I don't think he would break out of it.

And while I don't think she'd think it's a weapon right away, she'd be suspicious once he starts aiming it or trying to use it.

oh the fire minimum is like 1,100 C but it can gain energy from the air and other objects including the chains Judgements throws so it likley will increase much more than that (ig around 3,500 C considering it's in the sin machine and her chains have fire with them)

1100 Celsius shouldn't be too bad given her flames should be around (If not above) that temperature and she handles it pretty well. 3,500 could be an issue if she were exposed to it for a while.

Also the weapon basically makes her chains lose kinetic energy (it has energy manipulation) so they won't hurt Chris as much anymore so even if he can't harm her with it, he basically disabled her only attack and can try to CQC her

That depends on how fast it can absorb energy. I assume it scales to his combat speed, but Judgement's chains are over 10x their combat speed. Meaning it'd hardly get the chance to absorb the energy of any chain launched at him. The thermal energy is valid, but it decreasing the potency of her launched chains would only be by an insignificant amount by the time it reaches him.

 

[Board3659]

The luck didn't seem all that potent. Just let him never get in a bus accident (The chances of never getting in one while not optimal is fairly high). While this is an anecdote, I myself have never been in an bus accident throughout all my years of schooling. It'd be a different case if the luck made a machine gun miss every shot or smth, but just never getting in a bus accident? That's not very potent luck. Judgement should be able to hit him pretty easily.
(I meant if she spawned a chain onto the oh reliant)

Bus accidents happen so often IN this world (his earth isn't like ours) for external reasons (hand people) and again it happens 62% of the time EACH DAY so this means he is fine after 184 days of no accidents

ig you mistake what that means. He is doing essentially a coin flip each day and got tails 184 times (His luck is 1 out of 6.3106031e-39) so range attacks are a no go
(she has to spawn them on him which she usually ignoring the luck but it means I doubt she will take the weapon)

Given the chains are City Block level and you need to break out of it based on LS and not AP (Unless you have a concussive aura like in Dragon Ball), I don't think he would break out of it.

And while I don't think she'd think it's a weapon right away, she'd be suspicious once he starts aiming it or trying to use it.

oh ok that's how that works in breaking them
now even if she realized, it could be too late since any attempts will be failed by either luck or his weapon just slow her chains energy
Plus it's a pencil to her and he doesn't aim it he just spawns fire instantly in a 90-meter radius

1100 Celsius shouldn't be too bad given her flames should be around (If not above) that temperature and she handles it pretty well. 3,500 could be an issue if she were exposed to it for a while.

nothing to say here tbh though if her flames are more than 1,100 C he can just absorb the energy to make his fire even more stronger

That depends on how fast it can absorb energy. I assume it scales to his combat speed, but Judgement's chains are over 10x their combat speed. Meaning it'd hardly get the chance to absorb the energy of any chain launched at him. The thermal energy is valid, but it decreasing the potency of her launched chains would only be by an insignificant amount by the time it reaches him.

Since it spawns fire instantly, it also absorbs energy fast. The Heat manipulator absorbs double the amount of heat it makes capping at 10,000 C of absorption. reaching that point takes 2.2 seconds (if there is enough energy for him to make 5,000 C fires) and it's also a constant thing (it's dependent on either enough energy is around for it to continue absorbing that amount). I'll give you that the kinetic energy of the Chains won't be slowed down significantly enough though I think it would be enough to decrease the thermal energy enough

Also ... can her chains surpass his High-mid regen?

 

[LaserPrecision]

Bus accidents happen so often IN this world (his earth isn't like ours) for external reasons (hand people) and again it happens 62% of the time EACH DAY so this means he is fine after 184 days of no accidents

ig you mistake what that means. He is doing essentially a coin flip each day and got tails 184 times (His luck is 1 out of 6.3106031e-39) so range attacks are a no go
(she has to spawn them on him which she usually ignoring the luck but it means I doubt she will take the weapon)

That makes it slightly better. But I think landing a head 184 times (1 each day) isn't the same as landing a head 5000 times in 5 seconds (Essentially having every bullet of a machine gun or every single raindrop miss you back to back without being touched once). If there was a different showing that showed projectiles far faster than them missing back to back, I'd find it more believable for them to be able to dodge all of Judgement's chains, but otherwise, I feel numerous of them would connect with maybe a few missing here and there.

oh ok that's how that works in breaking them
now even if she realized, it could be too late since any attempts will be failed by either luck or his weapon just slow her chains energy
Plus it's a pencil to her and he doesn't aim it he just spawns fire instantly in a 90-meter radius

Well I mean her starting move is spawning a chain around people. She did so against Helltaker and against her fellow Demons. Against someone she's trying to kill, she will immediately go for burning their skin off. If they have a counter to that, they're good. If they don't, Judgement could win on the first move. If that didn't work, then they'd start flinging chains at him, which again, due to scaling 10x above their combat speeds would unlikely have any relevant amount of energy absorbed from them by the time they hit, still hitting him with most of their force.

Well yea it's a pencil, but Judgement is from Hell. I don't think she's ever even seen a pencil. She could very well see it and think it's a weapon (I mean, it can already be used for stabbing, so it can be a weapon irl under right circumstances, though it admittedly isn't a conventional one)

nothing to say here tbh though if her flames are more than 1,100 C he can just absorb the energy to make his fire even more stronger

Fair.

Since it spawns fire instantly, it also absorbs energy fast. The Heat manipulator absorbs double the amount of heat it makes capping at 10,000 C of absorption. reaching that point takes 2.2 seconds (if there is enough energy for him to make 5,000 C fires) and it's also a constant thing (it's dependent on either enough energy is around for it to continue absorbing that amount). I'll give you that the kinetic energy of the Chains won't be slowed down significantly enough though I think it would be enough to decrease the thermal energy enough

Also ... can her chains surpass his High-mid regen?

No, I don't think the chains would get around High-Mid regen (Although the description of the regen doesn't seem to meet High-Mid standards as it's currently worded. It can reach that level if worded differently tho). However, she doesn't need to kill him to win. Beating him until he loses consciousness or the will to fight would both serve as win-cons. Which given her job of torturing people to submission is very much possible.

 

[Board3659]

That makes it slightly better. But I think landing a head 184 times (1 each day) isn't the same as landing a head 5000 times in 5 seconds (Essentially having every bullet of a machine gun or every single raindrop miss you back to back without being touched once). If there was a different showing that showed projectiles far faster than them missing back to back, I'd find it more believable for them to be able to dodge all of Judgement's chains, but otherwise, I feel numerous of them would connect with maybe a few missing here and there.

I wouldn't say slightly better though in this example it probably isn't enough I should mention that the 1 out of 6.3106031e-39 is a minimum since a few times he had close calls when a car was thrown at him and no debris hit him. I do agree some of her chains would hit him

Well I mean her starting move is spawning a chain around people. She did so against Helltaker and against her fellow Demons. Against someone she's trying to kill, she will immediately go for burning their skin off. If they have a counter to that, they're good. If they don't, Judgement could win on the first move. If that didn't work, then they'd start flinging chains at him, which again, due to scaling 10x above their combat speeds would unlikely have any relevant amount of energy absorbed from them by the time they hit, still hitting him with most of their force.

Well yea it's a pencil, but Judgement is from Hell. I don't think she's ever even seen a pencil. She could very well see it and think it's a weapon (I mean, it can already be used for stabbing, so it can be a weapon irl under right circumstances, though it admittedly isn't a conventional one)

Trapping would be actually more effective than throwing since trapping ignores his luck unlike just throwing them. I would concede the point on her noticing the pencil as a potential weapon though I still doubt she will immediately go take it

No, I don't think the chains would get around High-Mid regen (Although the description of the regen doesn't seem to meet High-Mid standards as it's currently worded. It can reach that level if worded differently tho). However, she doesn't need to kill him to win. Beating him until he loses consciousness or the will to fight would both serve as win-cons. Which given her job of torturing people to submission is very much possible.

Oh that is when he is in his Zombie form he actually would be normally Low-Mid ... (how tf did I miss that)

High-Mid: The ability to regenerate from being blown/cut to pieces, brain included, or from a small piece of the user's body, such as a finger, or the heart.

His Zombie form is able to survive being decapitated as well as recovering it's body despite only it's limbs remaining

I apologize for not realizing this error just got to add it fast (doesn't change the fight besides Chris likley dies then fights as his Zombie form)


I do think making him Unconcious could work since he has been KO when fighting before

 

[LaserPrecision]

I wouldn't say slightly better though in this example it probably isn't enough I should mention that the 1 out of 6.3106031e-39 is a minimum since a few times he had close calls when a car was thrown at him and no debris hit him. I do agree some of her chains would hit him

If we agree some of the chains would hit we're good. Albeit I think the chains are harder to avoid than the listed examples of their luck.

Trapping would be actually more effective than throwing since trapping ignores his luck unlike just throwing them. I would concede the point on her noticing the pencil as a potential weapon though I still doubt she will immediately go take it

Yea, I don't think she would immediately take it. Just after becoming suspicious of it being a weapon or something.

Oh that is when he is in his Zombie form he actually would be normally Low-Mid ... (how tf did I miss that)

High-Mid: The ability to regenerate from being blown/cut to pieces, brain included, or from a small piece of the user's body, such as a finger, or the heart.

His Zombie form is able to survive being decapitated as well as recovering it's body despite only it's limbs remaining

I apologize for not realizing this error just got to add it fast (doesn't change the fight besides Chris likley dies then fights as his Zombie form)


I do think making him Unconcious could work since he has been KO when fighting before

Oh, well that's not as hard to deal with albeit still not easy to take care of. I think her torturing him until he gives up or passes out is a viable win-con given their fighting style.

 

[Board3659]

If we agree some of the chains would hit we're good. Albeit I think the chains are harder to avoid than the listed examples of their luck.

I should mention Chris stood still not trying to do anything but yeah I still agree on the idea of his Luck being not perfect for Danmaku

Technically Chris has dodged near Damaku-level stuff but the issue is his reaction speed is ALWAYS based on it being x2 his normal movement speed and b/c it's lowered to such a degree it means that his reaction speed and dodging skills don't matter against Judgement's significantly higher attack speed

Yea, I don't think she would immediately take it. Just after becoming suspicious of it being a weapon or something.

That gives time for him to start burning her. He could also decide to throw his phone as well to BFR her but her flight might make him miss

Oh, well that's not as hard to deal with albeit still not easy to take care of. I think her torturing him until he gives up or passes out is a viable win-con given their fighting style.

She could try not killing him and making him not go to his Zombie form which is High-mid ... I think he can be knocked out since he has been overwhelmed before and he isn't like someone used to full-on fighting to the death except in some instances.

Skill is equal imo though so I think it this depends on whether or not Judgement overwhelms him enough to make him fall unconscious before he tries to BFRor burn her

 

[LaserPrecision]

I should mention Chris stood still not trying to do anything but yeah I still agree on the idea of his Luck being not perfect for Danmaku

Technically Chris has dodged near Damaku-level stuff but the issue is his reaction speed is ALWAYS based on it being x2 his normal movement speed and b/c it's lowered to such a degree it means that his reaction speed and dodging skills don't matter against Judgement's significantly higher attack speed

Especially so when he's on the Sin-Machine which is constantly moving with spikes on each end.

That gives time for him to start burning her. He could also decide to throw his phone as well to BFR her but her flight might make him miss

It gives him some time. Albeit I don't think a lot. She does have a resistance to a fair amount of heat, so it would take a while of exposure to do any major damage.

She could try not killing him and making him not go to his Zombie form which is High-mid ... I think he can be knocked out since he has been overwhelmed before and he isn't like someone used to full-on fighting to the death except in some instances.

Skill is equal imo though so I think it this depends on whether or not Judgement overwhelms him enough to make him fall unconscious before he tries to BFRor burn her

That seems fair. Though how exactly does the phone BFR thing work?

 

[Board3659]

Especially so when he's on the Sin-Machine which is constantly moving with spikes on each end.

That should be a Tuesday for him since he goes running on highways dodging moving objects from the perspective of a car (so a car going the opposite direction is 2x faster than him yet he can dodge it). The sin machine is here for just for the Location though it would affect him if it was a long term battle of sorts but it's not

It gives him some time. Albeit I don't think a lot. She does have a resistance to a fair amount of heat, so it would take a while of exposure to do any major damage.

True but her fire, chains plus the sin machine just give him enough energy to get up to 5,000 C so it should overpower her after a bit of time

That seems fair. Though how exactly does the phone BFR thing work?

Oh so basically in .68 seconds with his phone, anything nearby it is teleported to the White void ... he can throw the phone to try to BFR her and he can throw up to 60 meters. Judgment could dodge it by flying or reacting to it but IDK since it's quite a close range and it's a portal so it has some range

 

[LaserPrecision]

That should be a Tuesday for him since he goes running on highways dodging moving objects from the perspective of a car (so a car going the opposite direction is 2x faster than him yet he can dodge it). The sin machine is here for just for the Location though it would affect him if it was a long term battle of sorts but it's not

The Sin Machine by itself isn't the problem. It's moreso the Sin Machine + Judgement's constant attacks.

True but her fire, chains plus the sin machine just give him enough energy to get up to 5,000 C so it should overpower her after a bit of time

Fair

Oh so basically in .68 seconds with his phone, anything nearby it is teleported to the White void ... he can throw the phone to try to BFR her and he can throw up to 60 meters. Judgment could dodge it by flying or reacting to it but IDK since it's quite a close range and it's a portal so it has some range

.68 is a relatively long time for subsonic character's. So I suppose she could evade it. Or knock it out of the air with her chains. Or a combination of the two. Does the teleportation work by the phone turning on or smth else?

 

[Board3659]

The Sin Machine by itself isn't the problem. It's moreso the Sin Machine + Judgement's constant attacks.

it could make screw him over when trapped

.68 is a relatively long time for subsonic character's. So I suppose she could evade it. Or knock it out of the air with her chains. Or a combination of the two. Does the teleportation work by the phone turning on or smth else?

it basically opens an app to spawn the portal ... of course, it would present itself as a hazard once in play.

Chris can drink Coffee to raise his movement speed to be able to just do it close range but he uses Coffee later on in fights or when it's night

He can negate her flying if he hits her with the belt or throws it at her but it will be hard to pull off.


His Grandpa's microphone will be able to make her Stats reduced but it will take a while and could be KO'd before he weakens her enough (though even just using it should be a good thing for him)

 

[Board3659]

bump

 

[Board3659]

Wait Chris has Weapon Manipulation

he is able to grab objects and weaponize them

couldn't he touch some of Judgement chains and manipulate them to act to his favor (either sending them back at her)

 

[LaserPrecision]

Wait Chris has Weapon Manipulation

he is able to grab objects and weaponize them

couldn't he touch some of Judgement chains and manipulate them to act to his favor (either sending them back at her)

Depends on the specifics of how it works. And what it can affect (As pretty much anything CAN be a weapon if used properly. Even stuff not intended to be one) as Judgement's chains are made from sins.

 

[Board3659]

Depends on the specifics of how it works. And what it can affect (As pretty much anything CAN be a weapon if used properly. Even stuff not intended to be one) as Judgement's chains are made from sins.

I mean he can make objects like a water bottle be like a modern artillery cannon or a pencil into a gun (and it should affect objects in general)

 

[LaserPrecision]

I mean he can make objects like a water bottle be like a modern artillery cannon or a pencil into a gun (and it should affect objects in general)

Wouldn't that be more like transmutation?

 

[Board3659]

Wouldn't that be more like transmutation?

well it still is a water bottle but it can shoot like modern artillery and yes the water is the same force of a shell

 

[LaserPrecision]

well it still is a water bottle but it can shoot like modern artillery and yes the water is the same force of a shell

So he just makes the water shoot with the force of modern artillery? Or does it actually become military? Those are two vastly different powers.

 

[Board3659]

So he just makes the water shoot with the force of modern artillery? Or does it actually become military? Those are two vastly different powers.

force of modern artillery

again it depends on the object on what it becomes but for mirrors he can use it to make heat rays or disc as a saw thing

Chains might simply be controllable by him or go back to Judgement

 

[LaserPrecision]

force of modern artillery

That seems more like water manipulation in that case since he's manipulating the water to shoot out with that force.

again it depends on the object on what it becomes but for mirrors he can use it to make heat rays or disc as a saw thing

Wouldn't that be transmutation again? This is kinda a confusing power

 

[Board3659]

That seems more like water manipulation in that case since he's manipulating the water to shoot out with that force.

Wouldn't that be transmutation again? This is kinda a confusing power

yeah it's transmution I didn't know how to explain it when I made my profile so yeah I'll fix that

 

[LaserPrecision]

yeah it's transmution I didn't know how to explain it when I made my profile so yeah I'll fix that

So assuming he did touch the chains (Unlikely given the speed difference), wouldn't they change into a different type of weapon?

 

[Board3659]

So assuming he did touch the chains (Unlikely given the speed difference), wouldn't they change into a different type of weapon?

make them behave differently when touching yes

it would mean intentionally burning himself to do it though

 

[LaserPrecision]

make them behave differently when touching yes

it would mean intentionally burning himself to do it though

Behave differently or transmute into a different weapon?

 

[Board3659]

I do question what is stopping Chris from doing CQC to one-shot judgment besides having to resist the chains

she can fly but he also can and has several options (plus can drink coffee to outspeed travel speed)

 

[Board3659]

Behave differently or transmute into a different weapon?

behave

he can't turn them into new objects just make them behave differently

 

[Board3659]

So assuming he did touch the chains (Unlikely given the speed difference), wouldn't they change into a different type of weapon?

I mean the chains are large so he just has to touch with his hands and make them behave differently
(it's vague since he rarely does it but it does make them have different properties)

 

[LaserPrecision]

I do question what is stopping Chris from doing CQC to one-shot judgment besides having to resist the chains

she can fly but he also can and has several options (plus can drink coffee to outspeed travel speed)

Because Judgement does their best to maintain distance between herself and the opponent. She'd avoid trying to be hit or the opponent getting in close.

behave

he can't turn them into new objects just make them behave differently

But you said he transmuted mirrors into heatrays?

I mean the chains are large so he just has to touch with his hands and make them behave differently
(it's vague since he rarely does it but it does make them have different properties)

The size isn't the problem. The size is they're so fast they're capable of blitzing him. It'd be nigh-impossible to intercept and touch one. Not to mention when he does touch it, it'll also cause damage to his hand.

 

[Board3659]

But you said he transmuted mirrors into heatrays?

no I said he makes mirrors act like heat rays ...
I need to write more clearly.

The size isn't the problem. The size is they're so fast they're capable of blitzing him. It'd be nigh-impossible to intercept and touch one. Not to mention when he does touch it, it'll also cause damage to his hand.

true and honestly ... he isn't going to be doing that thinking about it more

he will either use Oh reliant (already covered it) or the Grandpa Microphone

 

[LaserPrecision]

no I said he makes mirrors act like heat rays ...
I need to write more clearly.

Ohhh

true and honestly ... he isn't going to be doing that thinking about it more

he will either use Oh reliant (already covered it) or the Grandpa Microphone

Alr

 

[Board3659]

ok so would the Grandpa microphone work well enough against Judgement?
specifically the first one