Isshiki Ōtsutsuki vs Six Paths Sage Madara (Rinne-Sharingan)

[Chosensan]

Isshiki Himself - 7 (@UchihaSlayer96, @joshpiece, @Shadyboi0, @Avengershows, @Pain_to12, @theultimate5105, @LightReinh12345)

Peak Madara - 1 (@TheRedEmpty)

Inconclsuive - 0

Speed Equalized

Fight Location - Cell Games Arena (Dragon Ball Z)

First thread here, not sure if I am doing this right.

 

[Purgy]

Isshiki should fodderize in raw stats but he can't do anything about;

1. Infinite Tsukuyomi, he has no resistance
2. Limbo, he can't sense or interact with them
3. TSB's, doesn't have resistance to deconstruction or the power nullification listed on his profile like Madara or any of the Six Paths characters do

So it really comes down to if Madara's regen and Limbo can buy him enough time to cast IT or get lucky with TSB's, which I'm not sure if he can

 

[Chosensan]

Bump

 

[Chosensan]

Bump

 

[Chosensan]

Bump

 

[Chosensan]

Bump

 

[TheRedEmpty]

Limbo can do everything Madara can, practically a 5v1 for the limited time the limbo remains, and FRA see no chance of Isshiki winning

 

[Chosensan]

Kind of an old thread, but still, Bump

 

[Axxtentacle]

"speed unequalized" then Isshiki just ******* blitzes and 1 shots lmao, Isshiki scales wayyyyyy above the current sasuke and naruto who are way above their old forms by this point cause of power-cliffing bs

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

This is literally a stomp my guy

 

[Chosensan]

Made it speed equalized, if it's still a stomp then RIP ig

 

[TheRedEmpty]

"speed unequalized" then Isshiki just ******* blitzes and 1 shots lmao, Isshiki scales wayyyyyy above the current sasuke and naruto who are way above their old forms by this point cause of power-cliffing bs

So did Naruto and Sasuke get stronger by standing still for ten years? It doesn't make any sense, and even during the war (yes, they were stronger in the war), they didn't win, and we can't see the strength/speed etc of Madara's peak. They were able to "rival" Madara before absorbing the divine tree, which already gave him more strength attributes and before the awakening of the rine-sharingan too, which also increased his strength. Its peak was not even shown

 

[Axxtentacle]

So did Naruto and Sasuke get stronger by standing still for ten years? It doesn't make any sense, and even during the war (yes, they were stronger in the war), they didn't win, and we can't see the strength/speed etc of Madara's peak. They were able to "rival" Madara before absorbing the divine tree, which already gave him more strength attributes and before the awakening of the rine-sharingan too, which also increased his strength. Its peak was not even shown

"standing still for ten years" oh jesus christ... Naruto is the ONLY ONE who got SOMEWHAT rusty. Naruto in the last is CONSTANTLY training and getting stronger and gets a whole nother half of the ninetails. Are you forgetting that Sasuke was out constantly doing missions and getting stronger as well?

The madara portion is completely irrelevant. Naruto held his own against Kaguya very well who is stated to be in a whole new league of power compared to Madara, and the only indication we ever get of him being weaker is literally just him not fighting for an unknown amount of time then still ******* up Momoshiki when having a significant portion of his chakra drained.

If you're gonna come out here and argue bs like this, then don't make matches.

 

[M3X_2.0]

Why are we considering Isshiki to be faster and stronger than Madara? They scale to the same value for everything. There are no relation between Boruto God Tiers and Naruto God Tiers.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Guys it doesn't matter, speed is equalized now.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

The madara portion is completely irrelevant. Naruto held his own against Kaguya very well who is stated to be in a whole new league of power compared to Madara.

Kaguya who was superior to madara only in chakra, stupid as a stone, practically a fighter trained against a random with power.

"standing still for ten years" oh jesus christ... Naruto is the ONLY ONE who got SOMEWHAT rusty. Naruto in the last is CONSTANTLY training and getting stronger and gets a whole nother half of the ninetails. Are you forgetting that Sasuke was out constantly doing missions and getting stronger as well?

It has not been 10 years since the end of the shippuden until the beginning of "The last", he is still the same. No, he didn't continue training after that. Forgetting who? Sasuke, probably the second strongest in missions where there is no difficulty, do you really think he got stronger doing these missions?

 

[Axxtentacle]

Kaguya who was superior to madara only in chakra, stupid as a stone, practically a fighter trained against a random with power.

chakra = power??

It has not been 10 years since the end of the shippuden until the beginning of "The last", he is still the same. No,

It doesn't matter, the fact is that he trained and got stronger.

he didn't continue training after that. Forgetting who? Sasuke, probably the second strongest in missions where there is no difficulty, do you really think he got stronger doing these missions?

Not specifically missions, he just went out to do some shit that would HAVE to be training unless you think Naruto with another half of the ninetails + more training is weaker than he was before with no real indication of that.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Anyway, I guess imma go with Isshiki here. Sure, he doesn't resist any of Madara's haxes, but I think he has realistic ways to deal with some of them.
TSBs get shrunken and BFR'd, so while they would one shot Isshiki if they land, they probably won't.

Isshiki himself can shrink to avoid attacks and detection, and plant Chakra Rods from within Madara's body using his Dojutsu to immobilize him and drain his chakra.

Isshiki can also BFR Madara with his Space-Time Ninjutsu, and seal him away in a different dimension. He can also use the giant blocks to disrupt Madara's sensory capabilities as well.

IT is obviously an instant win con, but I don't think Madara will get the chance to use it due to Isshiki's constant pressuring.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Why are Naruto and Sasuke weaker in Boruto than in the War Arc? Naruto got another half of the Nine Tails (which is comparable/superior to the other Bijuu combined) and Sasuke mastered his Rinnegan and is constantly on missions. Naruto can spar this Sasuke to a standstill and they are stated to be equal in the guides.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Either way Isshiki still has a massive AP difference. Jigen casually destroyed both Naruto and Sasuke who aren't weaker than they were in the war arc, and Isshiki is just Jigen but >>>>>>.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

chakra = power??

In this case, yes. Madara with Rinne-sharingan has all the Kaguya jutsus with the exception of the bones probably, and changes in dimensions (Thing he just wouldn't have due to the lack of chakra). Kaguya only arrives at Large Star because of the chakra, if Madara had the same amount he could also make a sphere of truth of the same size.

It doesn't matter, the fact is that he trained and got stronger.

Where? When? proof

Not specifically missions, he just went out to do some shit that would HAVE to be training unless you think Naruto with another half of the ninetails + more training is weaker than he was before with no real indication of that.

Again, Where? When? proof. (I don't remember, but ..) Madara fought this naruto together with sasuke, and only remained rivaled at the beginning, at the time when he was understanding his skills (Thing that took minutes or seconds), after that he absorbed the tree, activated Tsukuyomi and was caught by zetsu

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Isshiki could also just shrink Madara's TSOs and stuff. And Madara has to fly up closer to the moon to set up his Infinite Tsukuyomi, unless he can activate it normally and just wanted area of effect but we don't know he can just mindhax people like that.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

Anyway, I guess imma go with Isshiki here. Sure, he doesn't resist any of Madara's haxes, but I think he has realistic ways to deal with some of them.
TSBs get shrunken and BFR'd, so while they would one shot Isshiki if they land, they probably won't.

He needs to touch them to shrink them, and that can bring his own end.

Isshiki himself can shrink to avoid attacks and detection, and plant Chakra Rods from within Madara's body using his Dojutsu to immobilize him and drain his chakra.

Madara can run away in different ways, one of which is Limbo, swapping places with them. Limbo that Isshiki cannot interact or see.

Isshiki can also BFR Madara with his Space-Time Ninjutsu, and seal him away in a different dimension. He can also use the giant blocks to disrupt Madara's sensory capabilities as well.

In his struggles he used limbo to stop attacks, it would be no different here, and despite being limited it would be enough time to eliminate Isshiki

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Isshiki could also just shrink Madara's TSOs and stuff. And Madara has to fly up closer to the moon to set up his Infinite Tsukuyomi, unless he can activate it normally and just wanted area of effect but we don't know he can just mindhax people like that.

He can just use normal genjutsu, but the Rinne-Sharingan reflecting off of the moon is necessary for planetary range/potency, yes.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

He needs to touch them to shrink them, and that can bring his own end.

Madara can run away in different ways, one of which is Limbo, swapping places with them. Limbo that Isshiki cannot interact or see.

In his struggles he used limbo to stop attacks, it would be no different here, and despite being limited it would be enough time to eliminate Isshiki

I don't think he needs to touch them. He was able to shrink Naruto's rasengan by looking at them. So he can just glance at the TSOs and shrink them. Then he can bully Madara and put tons of his rods in him.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

Isshiki could also just shrink Madara's TSOs and stuff. And Madara has to fly up closer to the moon to set up his Infinite Tsukuyomi, unless he can activate it normally and just wanted area of effect but we don't know he can just mindhax people like that.

There is nothing that can stop you from using it on the floor. It was probably a drama, or something needed for your first activation.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

There is nothing that can stop you from using it on the floor. It was probably a drama, or something needed for your first activation.

I mean he actively had to distract Naruto and Sasuke from fighting him to do it. It would seem weird if all that was just dramatical effect. He created tons of meteors.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

He needs to touch them to shrink them, and that can bring his own end.

He does not.

Madara can run away in different ways, one of which is Limbo, swapping places with them. Limbo that Isshiki cannot interact or see.

Isshiki can't see Limbo, yes, but Madara (and by extension his Limbo clones) can't see Isshiki while he's shrunk either.

In his struggles he used limbo to stop attacks, it would be no different here, and despite being limited it would be enough time to eliminate Isshiki

Sure, but substitution won't keep working forever. Not to mention, the mini chakra rods are near impossible to see coming or evade, as even SPSM Naruto couldn't sense them coming and Sasuke couldn't see them properly with his Rinnegan.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

I don't think he needs to touch them. He was able to shrink Naruto's rasengan by looking at them. So he can just glance at the TSOs and shrink them. Then he can bully Madara and put tons of his rods in him.

Rasengan is pure chakra, I don't remember seeing him use it in something similar to TSOs.

 

[Axxtentacle]

In this case, yes. Madara with Rinne-sharingan has all the Kaguya jutsus with the exception of the bones probably, and changes in dimensions (Thing he just wouldn't have due to the lack of chakra). Kaguya only arrives at Large Star because of the chakra, if Madara had the same amount he could also make a sphere of truth of the same size.

So... he's not as powerful. Thanks for the concession.

Where? When? proof

The training we know he did past the war arc because we see him train in The Last??? Along with him GETTING ANTHER HALF OF THE NINETAILS?

Again, Where? When? proof. (I don't remember, but ..) Madara fought this naruto together with sasuke, and only remained rivaled at the beginning, at the time when he was understanding his skills (Thing that took minutes or seconds), after that he absorbed the tree, activated Tsukuyomi and was caught by zetsu

"only rivalled at the beginning" you mean being literally cut in half by both of them with casual attacks :cringe:

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

He can just use normal genjutsu, but the Rinne-Sharingan reflecting off of the moon is necessary for planetary range/potency, yes.

It would be weird if Isshiki couldn't resist genjutsu though. Sasuke has some of the most potent genjutsu and doesn't use it against him. Though this is speculative.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Rasengan is pure chakra, I don't remember seeing him use it in something similar to TSOs.

Are you saying the TSOs aren't chakra?? lmao

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Rasengan is pure chakra, I don't remember seeing him use it in something similar to TSOs.

TSOs are lifeless objects and are made out of all chakra natures in one. Isshiki's ability works by shriking objects that doesn't have life and I don't see why the TSO would resist this.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Isshiki can't sense Limbo? Doesn't he have Six Paths chakra or at least some transdimensional cosmic awareness?

 

[TheRedEmpty]

He can just use normal genjutsu, but the Rinne-Sharingan reflecting off of the moon is necessary for planetary range/potency, yes.

Probably, but in this case, he wouldn't need to hit the whole world, just a target.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Probably, but in this case, he wouldn't need to hit the whole world, just a target.

But that's literally how the infinite tsukuyomi works

 

[TheRedEmpty]

He does not.

Isshiki can't see Limbo, yes, but Madara (and by extension his Limbo clones) can't see Isshiki while he's shrunk either.

Sure, but substitution won't keep working forever. Not to mention, the mini chakra rods are near impossible to see coming or evade, as even SPSM Naruto couldn't sense them coming and Sasuke couldn't see them properly with his Rinnegan.

(If I'm not mistaken, naruto can find him with senin mode, or sasuke with rinnegan .. in both cases, madara has both.) Limbo can do everything madara can, so he can use senin mode and find him exactly as naruto did. In my view, the fight would be balanced ... however, with the limbo, it becomes a 5 against 1, and in this case 4 of them ishhiki cannot see or touch them, so she couldn’t even fight back, madara could easily finish the struggle in this short period of limbo. And this is just counting the limbo, without genjutsu and sphere.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Isshiki can't sense Limbo? Doesn't he have Six Paths chakra or at least some transdimensional cosmic awareness?

Nah, I don't think he has very good sensing to begin with. He had to search for Kawaki manually using his Byakugan iirc.

 

[Axxtentacle]

That would be fine if Isshiki didn't have a massive AP advantage that's to the level of a significantly weakened Isshiki fondling both Naruto and Sasuke fine, a Naruto who has shadow clones which rival his limbo clones.

 

[TheRedEmpty]

"only rivalled at the beginning" you mean being literally cut in half by both of them with casual attacks :cringe:

Well, you located what happened at the beginning, at the moment when he was understanding the naruto techniques and that he had been caught off guard, just stated what I said. And the cut was so irrelevant that he just kept flying, going after his full power.

So... he's not as powerful. Thanks for the concession.

Yes, he is less powerful than Kaguya in terms of power, just like everyone else in the naruto univers

The training we know he did past the war arc because we see him train in The Last??? Along with him GETTING ANTHER HALF OF THE NINETAILS?

I don't remember that right, did he get the other half after the end of the war?