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Rock Lee upgrade

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Nullflowerblush

Nullflowerblush

He/Him
8,897
7,646
At least City Block level+ with Gates (Five times stronger than before, Damaged and almost defeated Gaara)
Click to expand...
Massively Hypersonic with Gates (Releasing the first gates multiplies Rock Lee's speed by five)
Click to expand...
No idea where the five-times value came from, because Guy explicitly states that the First Gate increases one's strength by dozens of times.
Lee in his normal state scales above Sasuke's 18.58 tons and scales to Gaara's sand's Mach 29.15452, so the First Gate would put him at 222.96 tons and Mach 349.85424, minimum.
The Third, Fourth, and Fifth Gates push him even further than that, so a far higher rating on top of that. His stats should look like:
At least Multi-City Block level with First Gate (Releasing the First Gate increases his power by dozens of times), far higher with Third, Fourth, and Fifth Gates (The Third, Fourth, and Fifth Gates far exceed the limitations of the First Gate. Completely dominated Gaara, and would have defeated him if not for his sand armor)
Click to expand...
At least Massively Hypersonic with First Gate, far higher with Third, Fourth, and Fifth Gates (Far surpassed the speed of Gaara's defense, and moved so fast he appeared invisible to Gaara)
Click to expand...
 
Pretty sure it's Kakashi saying that, not Guy.

Also pretty sure he's referring to all the gates when he says that, not specifically the first, I say this because the databook clearly refers to all the gates when it mentions an increase of dozens of times.
The Gate of Opening, Gate of Healing, Gate of Life, Gate of Pain, Gate of Limit, Gate of View, Gate of Wonder, and Gate of Death…The state when all Eight Gates are opened is called “Eight Gates Released Formation”. One’s physical abilities that are essentially lying dormant within the body are forcibly withdrawn, (augmenting) one’s faculties several dozens of times over. When it is employed, it even enables the user to perform taijutsu that one cannot typically unleash. Even by employing the First Gate through the Seventh Gate, the body is injured and damaged. As for the Eighth Gate…
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For those curious, the above translation comes from OrganicDinosaur who is basically the Herms of Naruto/Boruto.

Lastly, I vividly remember reading in previous threads that a databook page clearly states that the first gate increases ones physical power by 5 times, but I myself can't find this scan or translation so someone else might have to post it.

Actually, I think I found it, it's not from a databook but the manga.

Here's also the thread where the 5x for the first gate was accepted
 
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I agree. IDK where that five times thing comes from either since even the original JP doesn't say that either.

Granted I got tens of times but moreso since 何十倍 is a bit wonky for me to TL beyond putting it as "tens of times". Either way, I don't know how people get five times out of this at all.
 
Purgy said:
Also pretty sure he's referring to all the gates when he says that, not specifically the first
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He states that the limits that the Lotus breaks though allows the user to increase their strength by dozens of times, and then states that the Lotus only requires the First Gate to use, meaning that the First Gate is the one with that multiplier. There is some discrepancy between the 20% to 100% muscular energy statement and the Front Lotus statement; however, Guy also states that the Lotus pushes beyond the limits that their brain placed on them—beyond 100% of their muscular energy.
 
Nullflowerblush said:
He states that the limits that the Lotus breaks though allows the user to increase their strength by dozens of times, and then states that the Lotus only requires the First Gate to use, meaning that the First Gate is the one with that multiplier. There is some discrepancy between the 20% to 100% muscular energy statement and the Front Lotus statement; however, Guy also states that the Lotus pushes beyond the limits that their brain placed on them—beyond 100% of their muscular energy.
Click to expand...
To me it's pretty clear that he's referring to the 8 Gates in their entirety when he says dozens of times, when you include the full page and understand the context, it's clearly referring to them all at once, it helps that the databook translation by OrganicDinosaur I posted above supports the idea that it's all the gates being open which give an increase of dozens of times.

Nowhere does Guy say it pushes beyond 100%, he says it pushes beyond the limit the brain puts on usable muscle energy, which is around 20%.

So yeah, I disagree with the OP and think it should stay as it is, preferably the five times multiplier justification on Guy and Lee's profile should link to the thread where it was accepted imo.

On second thought, after reading Qliphoth_Bacikal's translation of the page, it does seem to indicate the first gate gives an increase akin to dozens of times, but there's still the matter of Guy's other statement and the databook, so consider me neutral for now.
 
Purgy said:
Pretty sure it's Kakashi saying that, not Guy.

Also pretty sure he's referring to all the gates when he says that, not specifically the first, I say this because the databook clearly refers to all the gates when it mentions an increase of dozens of times.

For those curious, the above translation comes from OrganicDinosaur who is basically the Herms of Naruto/Boruto.

Lastly, I vividly remember reading in previous threads that a databook page clearly states that the first gate increases ones physical power by 5 times, but I myself can't find this scan or translation so someone else might have to post it.

Actually, I think I found it, it's not from a databook but the manga.

Here's also the thread where the 5x for the first gate was accepted
Click to expand...
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
I agree. IDK where that five times thing comes from either since even the original JP doesn't say that either.

Granted I got tens of times but moreso since 何十倍 is a bit wonky for me to TL beyond putting it as "tens of times". Either way, I don't know how people get five times out of this at all.
Click to expand...
So it increases speed by more than five?
 
Purgy said:
Pretty sure it's Kakashi saying that, not Guy.

Also pretty sure he's referring to all the gates when he says that, not specifically the first, I say this because the databook clearly refers to all the gates when it mentions an increase of dozens of times.

For those curious, the above translation comes from OrganicDinosaur who is basically the Herms of Naruto/Boruto.

Lastly, I vividly remember reading in previous threads that a databook page clearly states that the first gate increases ones physical power by 5 times, but I myself can't find this scan or translation so someone else might have to post it.

Actually, I think I found it, it's not from a databook but the manga.

Here's also the thread where the 5x for the first gate was accepted
Click to expand...
Iirc it was for consistency sakes
 
The 5x was because of this.
9ky4fzr.png



100/20
 
The gates increase strength dozens of times but the first gate alone does not have that multiplier.
 
Since the 5x is an issue.

That is not a multiplier for the gates. That is a multiplier specifically with the LOTUS TECHNIQUE which they are talking about in the sentence.

This says nothing about speed, so that's scrapped
 
In the context of the original statement, it is talking about multiple limits being broken to get "dozens of times stronger". Not a single limit.
 
Damage3245 said:
The gates increase strength dozens of times but the first gate alone does not have that multiplier.
Click to expand...
for consistency issue the first gate should be a 5X multiplier and maybe the rest will be increased from there.

KingTempest said:
Since the 5x is an issue.

That is not a multiplier for the gates. That is a multiplier specifically with the LOTUS TECHNIQUE which they are talking about in the sentence.

This says nothing about speed, so that's scrapped
Click to expand...
Lmao, please what is the Lotus technique? or why did guy say you need the first gate to be able to use the lotus technique?
 
Pain_to12 said:
Lmao, please what is the Lotus technique?
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Please tell me you read/watched Rock Lee versus Gaara.
No way you don't know the forward lotus.


Please read what the lotus is.

This is justified because Guy says that a regular lotus is straining to the body.
Lee uses a technique which hurts his body when another one didn't. That technique > his body > his regular 1st gate attacks.
Pain_to12 said:
or why did guy say you need the first gate to be able to use the lotus technique?
Click to expand...
You need a full Jinchuriki form to use a tailed beast bomb.
Are we scaling Jinchuriki to tailed beast bombs?

You need MS for Amaterasu.
Are we scaling MS users to Amaterasu?

Your logic is bad.
 
You know that if you're trying to implement a 24x Strength multiplier and drop the 5x strength and speed multiplier, you need to update a lot of the characters who are directly affected by the multiplier correct?
 
KingTempest said:
Please tell me you read/watched Rock Lee versus Gaara.
No way you don't know the forward lotus.


Please read what the lotus is.

This is justified because Guy says that a regular lotus is straining to the body.
Lee uses a technique which hurts his body when another one didn't. That technique > his body > his regular 1st gate attacks.
Click to expand...

I know what the lotus is, and you need to open the first gate so you can utilize the speed needed to perfom the technique
KingTempest said:
You know that if you're trying to implement a 24x Strength multiplier and drop the 5x strength and speed multiplier, you need to update a lot of the characters who are directly affected by the multiplier correct?
Click to expand...
Uhm what i said was the 5X is for the first gate, the dozens is for higher gate
KingTempest said:
You need a full Jinchuriki form to use a tailed beast bomb.
Are we scaling Jinchuriki to tailed beast bombs?

You need MS for Amaterasu.
Are we scaling MS users to Amaterasu?

Your logic is bad.
Click to expand...
false equivalency
 
It really seems like the dozens increase statement could apply to either one gate or multiple gates. But it seems too vague to concretely give it to each gate individually. Is there any other context to expand upon Kakashi’s explanation?
 
Pain_to12 said:
I know what the lotus is, and you need to open the first gate so you can utilize the speed needed to perfom the technique

false equivalency
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Here's a better argument then.

You need 6th gate to use Asakujaku which produces fire because of it's combat speed.
Every movement done in 6th gate isn't as fast as Asakujaku
Pain_to12 said:
Uhm what i said was the 5X is for the first gate, the dozens is for higher gate
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You can not use both.

Dozens is specifically stated for the lotus.
V49Ka7p.png


"Limits that the lotus uses chakra to forcibly override, enabling the user to draw upon strength that is dozens of times his usual level, even if the user's body is destroyed in the process.
Incidentally, the forward lotus opens only the first gate, Kaimon"

This is referring to the first gate.
 
KingTempest said:
Dozens is specifically stated for the lotus.
V49Ka7p.png


"Limits that the lotus uses chakra to forcibly override, enabling the user to draw upon strength that is dozens of times his usual level, even if the user's body is destroyed in the process.
Incidentally, the forward lotus opens only the first gate, Kaimon"

This is referring to the first gate.
Click to expand...

Damage3245 said:
In the context of the original statement, it is talking about multiple limits being broken to get "dozens of times stronger". Not a single limit.
Click to expand...




So the supporters are about to have people scaling to dozens of times of base speed of gate users.
Lol crazy verse revision about to happen
 
Pain_to12 said:
So the supporters are about to have people scaling to dozens of times of base speed of gate users.
Lol crazy verse revision about to happen
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Where does it say speed is amped to the same extent that strength is amped?
Crazy verse revision is definitely about to happen, since yall just shut down the reason why a bunch of characters are sub-rel, why anyone is MHS, a lot of stuff

Damage3245 said:
In the context of the original statement, it is talking about multiple limits being broken to get "dozens of times stronger". Not a single limit.
Click to expand...
No it does not.

They go along talking about each gate.
The dozens is for the first gate's technique, which is explicitly stated, then Kakashi goes to talk about the second and third gate.

It talks about one technique, the lotus, which Lee uses right before this statement.

In the context of the original statement, Kakashi describes the eight gates. Then he talks about the lotus which multiplies his strength by dozens.
 
KingTempest said:
Where does it say speed is amped to the same extent that strength is amped?
Crazy verse revision is definitely about to happen, since yall just shut down the reason why a bunch of characters are sub-rel, why anyone is MHS, a lot of stuff
Click to expand...
it talked about physical stats in general, and speed was shown to increase to the extent that gaara sand was no longer able to keep up, so no matter what the multiplier still stand, what they are arguing is scaling it to the dozens statement which gave a value, compared to an explanation of what the first gate does
 
Pain_to12 said:
it talked about physical stats in general, and speed was shown to increase to the extent that gaara sand was no longer able to keep up, so no matter what the multiplier still stand, what they are arguing is scaling it to the dozens statement which gave a value, compared to an explanation of what the first gate does
Click to expand...
Quote where it says all stats.

It says strength.

Never says all stats, ever.
 
I made a mistake by following this thread

I think the First Gate alone is a 5x strength and speed multiplier while the Lotus is the 24x strength multiplier
 
Bro even the 5x doesn't talk about the 1st gate, it talks about the Lotus.

People are just ignoring the lotus altogether
 
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