Chainsaw Man discussion thread

[Bruh]

I would usually call it a hyperbole, but then the story went out of it's way to call the arrows supernatural and near infinite in reserve, so it could very much be true.

Aki and Himeno are stated to be constantly dodging these arrows, so whatever the calc ends up scaling to would be their combat speed.

Just get everyone out of Athletic Human tier....god just saying that made me gag, and i'll be happy

 

[Epiccheev]

Why high end when it's stated by the story ?

Cuz i love lowball

 

[Breadbear83]

at last this recalc got accepted, was about to make the 5th bump of it

Back at Supersonic fodders! it just increases the original calc by like 1.4x, so everyone currently scaling to the feat just gets the value of the recalc, simple CRT that i could do myself tomorrow, if theres something else about the speed ratings, could be on a more important CRT, as that refers to scaling chains

CRT was made, in the meanwhile gonna make the Aki Calc

 

[Bruh]

Cuz i love lowball

Guess only one of us can stay

 

[Breadbear83]

also this would be the 3rd feat of low tiers dodging guns, there was Long blocking bullet,s Nail Fiend dodging rifle fire, and this, could this counter argument the Guns antifeats?

4 if you count the Anime

 

[GunshyFever]

could this counter argument the Guns antifeats?

Considering that this proves Aki can at least react to bullet like projectiles, then yeah.

 

[Epiccheev]

Yeah, a big plot point of so many Devil hunters dying during Katana man's arc was that they were sneak attacked by acts of terrorism featuring guns.
In a normal scenario where both combatants are on guard/aware of eachother they almost never get tagged by gunfire.

 

[Breadbear83]

Yeah, a big plot point of so many Devil hunters dying during Katana man's arc was that they were sneak attacked by acts of terrorism featuring guns.
In a normal scenario where both combatants are on guard/aware of eachother they almost never get tagged by gunfire.

also they were all fodders, you cant compare an expert devil hunter that even Makima has trust on like Aki (and others like Himeno who are still part of the special divion 4) to rookie devil hunters that are stated that they dont live long in the job

 

[Zabazab]

Man doing calc with picture is already hard enough now you only have words to work with, how do the LN guys do it ?

We don't

 

[Epiccheev]

Man doing calc with picture is already hard enough now you only have words to work with, how do the LN guys do it ?

Regular LNs will usually just use the most lowballed value for Mountains/hills.
Funnily enough, Chinese LNs do have a tendency to use extremely specific numbers when presenting a feat like "Li huan fired his Karmic beam, vaporizing Ling Fei along with 69.730.000.056 acres of farmland"

 

[AnimesFreak2]

For reference (In AP): Transformed Quanxi ~ Weakened Pochita ~< Santa Claus ~ Makima (upscales from the Snake Devil physically)

I get Quanxi hurt Pochita so she could downscale but I wouldn't say she is exactly equal considering Pochita literally one shot her while weakened no less

 

[Zabazab]

Quanxi blocked his chainsaw and then shot 3 holes through Pochita, which killed him.

 

[Epiccheev]

They were able to trade killing blows, i'd say it's fair to say they scale.

 

[Breadbear83]

CRT was made, in the meanwhile gonna make the Aki Calc

this would be the calc, does it looks fine in methodica and explanation? dont think the story points out more stuff about the Machine gun statement not being hyperbole to add it as scans

 

[GunshyFever]

this would be the calc, does it looks fine in methodica and explanation? dont think the story points out more stuff about the Machine gun statement not being hyperbole to add it as scans

The supernatural stuff and the fact that they're stated to be pretty powerful should be enough.

 

[Breadbear83]

Noticed something wrong with Eljoaki5 Oregon calc: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:ElJoaki5/Chainsaw_Man:_Michigan_&_Oregon_Sword_Full_Calc

First, for the speed, it calculates how long it would take people to fall down the 1000 Meters of average elevation from sea level of oregon, using terminal velocity and stuff, it gives a timeframe of 22.37 seconds to fall down

But then, it adds 3 more seconds (25.37 seconds) as 3 frames after people fell to the sea, the sword reaching yoru, so the the speed calc is assuming that the sword started heading to Yoru AS SOON as people started falling, but from the scan itself, its clear that the buildings forming together the sword haven't fully gotten together even while people were already midway falling:

So timeframe should be assumed maybe a few seconds shorter as the sword would start heading to Yoru after the 22.37 seconds timeframe already started, the 3 seconds can be added tho (the sword first is created, then heads to Yoru)

As for KE calc, it uses the 25.37 seconds timeframe from earlier, but that was the sword travelling to Yoru, it clearly takes the sword less time to form itself (that's what the KE calc is about), than to travell to Yoru, cuz the first one is the first step, and the second is 2 steps


So in summary, I do think it's fine that the timeframe of people starting to fall to when the sword gets to Yoru being 25.37 seconds is fine, but the sword creation finishing happens before this timeframe ends, then the timeframe of the sword travelling happens

Unsure if it would be accepted, but I'd split the 25.37 seconds timeframe in half, as it's literally 2 different steps of creation and travell

 

[Bimbitesthedust]

Hadnt touched vsbw forums in a fat minute and I come back seeing JJK's verse page as outdated now and tier 5 CSM

well outside of voting on certain things but thats like the time to read the thread and then the time to make a simple response

 

[Breadbear83]

Hadnt touched vsbw forums in a fat minute and I come back seeing JJK's verse page as outdated now and tier 5 CSM

Everyone could notice the verse was outdated with a bit of research, Teen Gojo still having unknown Physical AP, and several characters like Mahoraga with Unknown LS

And damn the calcs of the verse must have been wanked for several of them being downgraded by over 100x after people checked them (I knew High 7C uraume was wank)

 

[Bimbitesthedust]

Everyone could notice the verse was outdated with a bit of research, Teen Gojo still having unknown Physical AP, and several characters like Mahoraga with Unknown LS

And damn the calcs of the verse must have been wanked for several of them being downgraded by over 100x after people checked them (I knew High 7C uraume was wank)

The verse didnt have outdated tags outside of like Uraume for a long time, It just came in where the entire verse and all the profiles now have that tag

 

[Bruh]

this would be the calc, does it looks fine in methodica and explanation? dont think the story points out more stuff about the Machine gun statement not being hyperbole to add it as scans

Beside if it was only meant to be hyperbole, they couldve just said the arrows were "faster than sound" or "as fast as a bullet". Explicitly stating they are machine gun lv seems deliberate

 

[Bruh]

I see on the Devil physi page that Primals have Madness and Fear Manip, shouldnt that make Pochita, PFB Yoru and Denji have resist since they can stand in the presence Aging and Fire with no problem ? Maybe Primals can have resist as well since the mental image of 2 Primals stunlocking each other when they meet is pretty funny but i dont have any argument for that other than them upscaling from Yoru and Makima

 

[Epiccheev]

Yeah, Pochita and Yoru definitely should as Devils with senses like them would be fully affected by their terror.
Denji im not sure since and Quanxi didnt seem to be affected at all.

 

[Bruh]

Yeah, Pochita and Yoru definitely should as Devils with senses like them would be fully affected by their terror.
Denji im not sure since and Quanxi didnt seem to be affected at all.

Denji was transformed when he met Fire so he should to as well

 

[Zabazab]

Fire isn't said to primal

 

[Epiccheev]

The vibes tho

 

[Bruh]

Damn somehow i gaslit myself into thinking Fire is a Primal fear. I truly am a curse CSM fan

 

[Breadbear83]

Noticed something wrong with Eljoaki5 Oregon calc: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:ElJoaki5/Chainsaw_Man:_Michigan_&_Oregon_Sword_Full_Calc

First, for the speed, it calculates how long it would take people to fall down the 1000 Meters of average elevation from sea level of oregon, using terminal velocity and stuff, it gives a timeframe of 22.37 seconds to fall down

But then, it adds 3 more seconds (25.37 seconds) as 3 frames after people fell to the sea, the sword reaching yoru, so the the speed calc is assuming that the sword started heading to Yoru AS SOON as people started falling, but from the scan itself, its clear that the buildings forming together the sword haven't fully gotten together even while people were already midway falling:

So timeframe should be assumed maybe a few seconds shorter as the sword would start heading to Yoru after the 22.37 seconds timeframe already started, the 3 seconds can be added tho (the sword first is created, then heads to Yoru)

As for KE calc, it uses the 25.37 seconds timeframe from earlier, but that was the sword travelling to Yoru, it clearly takes the sword less time to form itself (that's what the KE calc is about), than to travell to Yoru, cuz the first one is the first step, and the second is 2 steps


So in summary, I do think it's fine that the timeframe of people starting to fall to when the sword gets to Yoru being 25.37 seconds is fine, but the sword creation finishing happens before this timeframe ends, then the timeframe of the sword travelling happens

Unsure if it would be accepted, but I'd split the 25.37 seconds timeframe in half, as it's literally 2 different steps of creation and travell

This calc and others 2 may had something to address, so alongside this I mention the others in a CGM thread: https://vsbattles.com/threads/chainsaw-man-minor-calc-fixes.192098/#post-7778569

Second calc is wrong destruction values, while the third is methodica

 

[Breadbear83]

Why does Santa scale to the Snake Demon?

that’s my question too, yeah. maybe it’s just the fact that there’s literally primal fear flesh in ‘em and seemingly these powers are integral for at least gaining the confidence to approach makima

The scaling chain around Snake Devil can be explained better by including Post Fear Boost Yoru

Before Asa got the fear boost from Yoru, she got speedblitzed by Yoshida and got her arm effortlessly cut by him, but as soon as she got it, she could react to the second attack, and only received a minor damage in her fingers, this is the current example of fear scaling we use, even more, Yoshida desperately attempted to use Octopus Devil so he crashes Yoru, But she didnt receive any damage from the crashing (the Room 606 sword wouldnt give her more durability, just more AP) and also Yoru direcly speed blitzed Yoshida

in AP, the scaling chain goes around like this:

Kobeni (could pierce throught Aki´s Devil hunter uniform, which are stated and shown to be durable, that scales to 83.74 Tons of TNT) < Kishibe (stated by Makima to be the strongest devil hunter in special division 4 alongside Angel, this puts him above Kobeni, has also keep up with a holding Back Quanxi, this could upscale him to Baseline 8A, which is 100 Tons of TNT) < Yoshida (Kishibe said that Yoshida is a devil hunter of higher level than him, Yoshida could also keep up with Quanxi in a similar level to Kishibe) < Octopus Devil (like any contractor Devil, hes physically stronger than Yoshida, its clear with how Yoshida used Octopus when his sword didnt hurt Asa, Octopus could also somewhat harm a Low blood Part 2 Pochita, being a clearly powerful Devil, possibly comparable to Snake Devil) < Snake Devil (443 Tons of TNT)

People Above Snake Devil: Post Fear boost Yoru (physically stronger than Octopus Devil, far superior than others like Kobeni and Kishibe, and also Yoshida whos stronger than them, the Fear scaling can have her above Snake Devil with how much feared War become, this may upscale her to Baseline 8A+, which is 550 Tons of TNT) < Human Quanxi (overwhelmed Yoru even while she got help from Nail Fiend) < Hybrid Quanxi (obviously stronger, thought she has claimed to still be stronger than Post Fear Boost Denji, which rather makes inconsistencies in scaling if it were true) ≈ Nightime Santa (could catch arrows from Hybrid Quanxi, arrows who are faster than her physical speed, could speed blitz Denji and harm him) < Weakened Pochita (killed Hybrid Quanxi in a short time even while low on blood after fighting the Zombies and the other Hybrids) < Makima (Beaten Pochita in a physical fight even after giving him blood to make it fair)

speed wise the scaling chain is supposed to be similar, thought Kobeni could be faster than Snake Devil as she dodged an attack from him

as far as i know, Makima is physically the strongest Character of the Snake Devil scaling, as everyone Physically stronger than her scales to some Gun Devil Feat like Part 1 Pochita

(looking at how long the scaling chain is, couldnt some other character besides human Quanxi scale to Katana Man Sword draw Dash? Yoru doesnt seems that far away from Quanxi Speed Blitzing Katana Man)

 

[GunshyFever]

Kobeni (could pierce throught Aki´s Devil hunter uniform, which are stated and shown to be durable, that scales to 83.74 Tons of TNT) <

Minor error, the public safety jacket scaling is much higher now.

443 Tons of TNT (Post-Training Chainsaw Man) < Public Safety Jackets (now a 1.24 difference relative to Katana Man's katanas for consistency) < Pseudo Chainsaw Man's chainsaws < Tokyo Detention Centre confinement < Katana Man's katanas ~ Denji's chainsaws ~ Reze's explosions

 

[Breadbear83]

Minor error, the public safety jacket scaling is much higher now.

oh then everyone here is 8A+. thought some profiles like Kobeni one still has her at 8B

 

[GunshyFever]

oh then everyone here is 8A+. thought some profiles like Kobeni one still has her at 8B

Those will be updated and not everyone is 8-A+. Likely only CSM War Yoru and PFP Denji would scale there physically. The scaling for all of it will be addressed in an upcoming CRT.

 

[Bruh]

Since everyone and their mother will pretty much be 8-A, shouldnt some of them scale to Snake's Class M and if Bread new calc gets accepted, the 8-A+ could scale to that one ?

 

[Breadbear83]

Since everyone and their mother will pretty much be 8-A, shouldnt some of them scale to Snake's Class M and if Bread new calc gets accepted, the 8-A+ could scale to that one ?

Mákima could upscale to weakened Pochita LS, but the rest are weaker, at most hybrid Quanxi who can push Pochita could scale to, and therefore Nighttime Santa, but then you had the clear gap of Human quanxi being weaker than her hybrid form, and even weaker is Yoru

Yeah LS ratings need some fix, they are supposed to be somewhat relative to AP scaling, yet some 8A characters like post weakening denji are Class 5 from powers feat, another thing for the list

 

[GunshyFever]

Mákima could upscale to weakened Pochita LS, but the rest are weaker, at most hybrid Quanxi who can push Pochita could scale to, and therefore Nighttime Santa, but then you had the clear gap of Human quanxi being weaker than her hybrid form, and even weaker is Yoru

Yeah LS ratings need some fix, they are supposed to be somewhat relative to AP scaling, yet some 8A characters like post weakening denji are Class 5 from powers feat, another thing for the list

I don't think anyone apart from Makima and those physically relative to or above her would scale to it.

 

[Bruh]

yet some 8A characters like post weakening denji are Class 5 from powers feat, another thing for the list

PW Denji's physicals is only 8-C, hes only 8-A with his chainsaws via Yuko

 

[Breadbear83]

Chainsaw Man: Minor calc fixes

so theres these 3 Chainsaw Man calcs, all are accepted, but theres small things about them that would change them and may be addresed 1: Oregon Sword Calc, Speed and Speed of KE The math of this calc is accepted, but its not being used in scaling yet cuz we have to wait for a CRT for it (Feat...

vsbattles.com

I think gunshyfever mentioned them before, but there are cases like Yoru being able to lift the building sword, yet shortly after she can't get up from Falling Devil throwing a building on top of her (but the sword still was pointed out has heavy)

Pre fear boost Yoru could lift the aquarium spear effortlessly even while it was a whole building, not implied to be heavy, and would be an outlier if so early she had Class K/M LS

Rarely does Yorus arms that are made of the gigantic gun devil (and so tank devil) are ever shown to be heavy, only time was Yoru changing Tank Devil into a big gun

 

[Bruh]

PFB Pochita should have Layered Conceptual Erasure and Mememory manip no ? He was able to effectively erase himself despite Hybrids having resist and things that he erases cant be remembered by Yoru despite her remembering things like Nuke

 

[Breadbear83]

AP ki

PFB Pochita should have Layered Conceptual Erasure and Mememory manip no ? He was able to effectively erase himself despite Hybrids having resist and things that he erases cant be remembered by Yoru despite her remembering things like Nuke

So you say that hybrids would have like 1 layer of resistance by resisting Pochita erasure, but also pochitas erasure on himself bypass 1 layer of resistance? That wouldn't work, the difference comes that pochitas erasure on himself just reset the timeline as this time it changes the past completely and not just accomdate it to the present

Also we do somehow still see Pochita as Denji's hearth

On mind manipulation resistance, Yoru and Makima should have 1 layer by remembering devil's, though makima would have 2 layers of mind manipulation by she as Nayuta manipulating Yorus memories

Considering the fact Denji felt something when asa said her corny phrase of Chainsaw Man, Pochitas erasure did had some memory manipulation on everyone, however would still be weird if this time it was a stronger one that made horsemen to forget him, but in all case, we only saw Nayuta who was dead by the time

If you want, specifically the self erasure can have 2 layers of mind manipulation (technically the same as Makima, but that's because Makima nor anyone else has 2 layers of resistance to it)

 

[Bruh]

AP ki
So you say that hybrids would have like 1 layer of resistance by resisting Pochita erasure, but also pochitas erasure on himself bypass 1 layer of resistance? That wouldn't work, the difference comes that pochitas erasure on himself just reset the timeline as this time it changes the past completely and not just accomdate it to the present

Also we do somehow still see Pochita as Denji's hearth

On mind manipulation resistance, Yoru and Makima should have 1 layer by remembering devil's, though makima would have 2 layers of mind manipulation by she as Nayuta manipulating Yorus memories

Considering the fact Denji felt something when asa said her corny phrase of Chainsaw Man, Pochitas erasure did had some memory manipulation on everyone, however would still be weird if this time it was a stronger one that made horsemen to forget him, but in all case, we only saw Nayuta who was dead by the time

If you want, specifically the self erasure can have 2 layers of mind manipulation (technically the same as Makima, but that's because Makima nor anyone else has 2 layers of resistance to it)

Makima and Yoru only have basic resist against Memory manip not 1 layer so like 0 layer, Nayuta/Makima have 1 layer of Memory manip for erasing Yoru's memory and Fear boosted Pochita should as well since she cant remember the things he erased despite previously could

 

[GunshyFever]

Snip

For your thread, you should try to add some tags for relevant characters related to it.