The Sun God Nika vs The Six Paths Sage (Luffy vs Naruto).

[Trihexa102]

You keep talking about the same shit and you don't understand anything of one piece yet you make objective claims based on ignorance and googled scans

First you said mind reading was a enel devil fruit application
Then you said that mantra is a different type of kenbun
Then you said future sight doesn't actually see the future
Then you said that it's never said that kenbun reads minds

You see things, you disagree, you make up what you want, then you say we're overhyping luffy's capabilities.

Then you compare it to naruto fighting a dude who predicts movements through muscle movements and you think it's the same as future sight and it's aggravating cause
1. You don't know what you're talking about
2. You talk like you do
3. Everyone who doesn't read One Piece agrees for your terrible reasons

cause you are overstating luffy's abilities.

Naruto's cause is literally me stating Naruto has literally different forms sensory abilities ALONG WITH HIS CLONES.

He is just more versatile and better equipped in a fight rn now unless luffy gets more things under his belt down the line.

Luffy's haki drains and so does his G5 he cannot outlast Naruto.

 

[KingTempest]

man, he literally says it on panel that luffy is getting as accurate as him. i can't keep repeating myself. Why would Katakuri want to end it quickly if luffy can't still consciouly activate it?

Because Haki works in the sense that WHEN YOU FIGHT SOMEONE STRONGER THAN YOU, YOUR HAKI CATCHES UP, and if his haki catches up, then that's a problem.

He probably rivaled Kat's FS by the end of whole cake but that's my opinion.

It is the truth. He GREW to rival Katakuri's by the end. Overtime, HE DID NOT.

Now you are arguing i don't know how Naruto fights?

Naruto attacks from different directions, regardless of thousands of aimed attacks. This same clones could fight madara's Limbo.

Not a scan sent.

Naruto can fight them limbo clones that's nice.
Luffy stretches your organs and sends you flying.

Naruto adapts and is very versatile, he can throw Nine different rasenshurken while which other clones are attacking as well, I just don't find it to be true that luffy can deal with all that unfortunately.

CP0 instance IS there as an example of FS drawbacks like i keep saying.

HE WASN'T USING FUTURE SIGHT

 

[DaReaperMan]

Funny case with something as explained as Haki, trying to say "oh X wasn't used" is like Tom Cat putting a shotgun through a wall, cause you will be more or less objectively wrong cause something out there will have explained it.

 

[Kachon123]

unquantifiable numbers, show me obvs or FS being able to sense or see 2000+

Sanji using basic Observation Haki to correct the crew by sensing 100,000 individuals when they initially eyeballed it to 30,000

 

[KingTempest]

cause you are overstating luffy's abilities.

You disagree with the wiki.
The wiki says these abilities.
You are in DENIAL.

Naruto's cause is literally me stating Naruto has literally different forms sensory abilities ALONG WITH HIS CLONES.

You haven't talked about Naruto's sensory abilities once in the past day. All you talk about is how Naruto fought Sharingan users and how observation haki isn't as good as it sounds.

He is just more versatile and better equipped in a fight rn now unless luffy gets more things under his belt down the line.

Versatility to a person who deflects everything. That's so nice.

Luffy's haki drains and so does his G5 he cannot outlast Naruto.

Luffy fought for 11 hours using haki the entire time and it did not drain.
Even if Luffy runs out of Gear 5th he's punching bombs in Naruto's body so none of this matters.

What's the most damage Naruto can take at once?
Cause Luffy's been tortured and kept consciousness.
Naruto got no feats of taking large amounts of damage. If he gets hit in the head by a few rubber exploding hits he's getting knocked out

 

[Trihexa102]

Katakuri seeing the future from multiple angles.

Luffy seeing the future from multiple angles.
Shanks seeing the future from multiple angles.

Need I say more?

You need to look at the profiles. Naruto's durability is 59 Zettatons. His clones are lower than that, but still around that 59 Zettatons value. Gear 5th Luffy's physicals are 59 Zettatons. Luffy's Armament Haki is far above that, and his Conqueror's Haki several times stronger than Armament Haki. There is no universe where they have higher durability, let alone "far higher"

The speed gap is 4x. As @Nierre mentioned, Luffy can use any of his other gears on top of Gear 5th, which includes Gear 2nd, which allows Luffy to blitz other blitz amps such as Soru. At Luffy's peak he absolutely can blitz Naruto. All it takes is for you to look at his profile.

Kizaru is far faster than Naruto so he had advantages that Luffy does not. Kizaru literally turned each of his Danmaku bullets into clones so I'm unsure how you can say with full confidence that he had lesser clones than Naruto. And even if he did, the gap is made up by speed that Naruto does not have.

Except it does. When Luffy turns something into rubber, he completely takes away their other properties. For example, when he used his powers on Kaidou's Bolo Breath, instead of melting through rock and detonating as it did a chapter before, it bounced back as rubber ball and didn't detonate until it left his range of influence.

Similarly, Luffy hit away nukes that explode on contact by with Subjective Reality simply because he believed they were poison balls instead.

i mean we still see luffy get attacked again by the cp0 y'all keep sweeping under the rug, it's there to show drawbacks for a reason.

Luffy's further attacks are unquantifiably above 59zt, it doesn't really help him here.

Since when can luffy stack gear 2 on gear 5 when even gear 5 drains him quickly? Kizaru is not faster than Naruto but i digress. Naruto has clones has fast with high level sensory and 100 times the number.

 

[Kachon123]

Since when can luffy stack gear 2 on gear 5 when even gear 5 drains him quickly?

Kizaru is not faster than Naruto but i digress.

Here's Kizaru outspeeding someone who is casually 35c before amping themselves

Naruto has clones has fast with high level sensory and 100 times the number

Luffy's sensory abilities are objectively far better. Luffy is over 4x faster than Naruto and can stack a blitz amp on top of that.

 

[Trihexa102]

You disagree with the wiki.
The wiki says these abilities.
You are in DENIAL.

You haven't talked about Naruto's sensory abilities once in the past day. All you talk about is how Naruto fought Sharingan users and how observation haki isn't as good as it sounds.

Versatility to a person who deflects everything. That's so nice.

Luffy fought for 11 hours using haki the entire time and it did not drain.
Even if Luffy runs out of Gear 5th he's punching bombs in Naruto's body so none of this matters.

What's the most damage Naruto can take at once?
Cause Luffy's been tortured and kept consciousness.
Naruto got no feats of taking large amounts of damage. If he gets hit in the head by a few rubber exploding hits he's getting knocked out

bruh i literally talked about his clones a few pages ago and you monkeyman ignored?

The wiki doesn't say they have the abilities as they are, it gives context and not just a blanket ability, otherwise anything would just go here.

luffy CANNOT deflect everything man. gonna stop repeating this.

Luffy is still not outlasting Naruto, hell he will drain much faster compared to anyone he has ever fought.

Naruto is cloaked he will be fine.

 

[Kachon123]

The wiki doesn't say they have the abilities as they are, it gives context and not just a blanket ability, otherwise anything would just go here.

You're arguing with the person who made that wiki page by the way.

luffy CANNOT deflect everything man. gonna stop repeating this.

Based on nothing but your feelings. Luffy's deflection is rooted in Reality Warping and Subjective Reality.

 

[KingTempest]

i mean we still see luffy get attacked again by the cp0 y'all keep sweeping under the rug, it's there to show drawbacks for a reason.

Luffy.
Did.
Not.
Use.
Future.
Sight.
When.
He.
Was.
Attacked.
By.
Cp0

Do we need to spell it out???

Luffy's further attacks are unquantifiably above 59zt, it doesn't really help him here.

Dura.
Neg.

Since when can luffy stack gear 2 on gear 5 when even gear 5 drains him quickly?

Gear 5th lets him use every gear whenever he wants. Read the damn series.

Kizaru is not faster than Naruto but i digress.

Kizaru is faster than Naruto.

Naruto has clones has fast with high level sensory and 100 times the number.

With terrible sensory ability compared to Luffy.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Do we need to spell it out???

Spell it out in Irish Gaelic, I think that'd get the point across

 

[KingTempest]

bruh i literally talked about his clones a few pages ago and you monkeyman ignored?

Wtf does his clones have to do with anything

The wiki doesn't say they have the abilities as they are, it gives context and not just a blanket ability, otherwise anything would just go here.

I'm the dude who made the page I know what it says.
It says that each level of kenbun shown there is used by the users.

luffy CANNOT deflect everything man. gonna stop repeating this.

Luffy's deflection is based on subjective reality why the hell would he not be able to deflect them?

Luffy is still not outlasting Naruto, hell he will drain much faster compared to anyone he has ever fought.

Naruto is cloaked he will be fine.

Naruto isn't taking more than 10 dura neg hits from Luffy.
A gatling gun puts Naruto down.

 

[Trihexa102]

Here's Kizaru outspeeding someone who is casually 35c before amping themselves

Luffy's sensory abilities are objectively far better. Luffy is over 4x faster than Naruto and can stack a blitz amp on top of that.

bruh how does that mean luffy has stacking gear 2 on gear 5? or he is just striking a pose?

Luffy is not even 2x faster than Naruto here so it would barely matter.

Naruto has a decent level of sensory abilities except FS, so yea he overwhelms luffy with his Clones.

 

[KingTempest]

Naruto has a decent level of sensory abilities except FS, so yea he overwhelms luffy with his Clones.

 

[Trihexa102]

Because Haki works in the sense that WHEN YOU FIGHT SOMEONE STRONGER THAN YOU, YOUR HAKI CATCHES UP, and if his haki catches up, then that's a problem.

It is the truth. He GREW to rival Katakuri's by the end. Overtime, HE DID NOT.

Not a scan sent.

Naruto can fight them limbo clones that's nice.
Luffy stretches your organs and sends you flying.

HE WASN'T USING FUTURE SIGHT

Yea so like i stated luffy's future sight was already becoming comparable to Luffy.

Nothing here proves luffy wins by way, it just proves luffy had to reflect just one attack from Kaido who has far less AOE spread compared to 1 naruto clone.

 

[Kachon123]

bruh how does that mean luffy has stacking gear 2 on gear 5? or he is just striking a pose?

And Luffy was "just striking a pose" here too, right?

Luffy is not even 2x faster than Naruto here so it would barely matter.

Naruto is 10c. Luffy is 40x before stacking Gear 2nd.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Ew, Burrito scan!

 

[Trihexa102]

See that where you are wrong am not gonna discount this like it don't matter so unfortunately something like this will never happen in this fight as Naruto would be fully focused with thousand of clones.

 

[KingTempest]

Yea so like i stated luffy's future sight was already becoming comparable to Luffy.

You're not illiterate.
You just choose not to read.
Luffy had regular kenbun. It was growing to future sight, but it did not reach full on future sight until later.
The Luffy who got hit by Flambe was the Luffy who was growing to future sight.

Nothing here proves luffy wins by way, it just proves luffy had to reflect just one attack from Kaido who has far less AOE spread compared to 1 naruto clone.

Gomu Gomu no Balloon.

That answers it all.

 

[Kachon123]

Nothing here proves luffy wins by way, it just proves luffy had to reflect just one attack from Kaido who has far less AOE spread compared to 1 naruto clone.

Luffy's rubberization range is the entire damn continent of Elbaph. Thousands of Kilometers. Naruto does not have AoE the size of the Continental United States.

 

[Trihexa102]

And Luffy was "just striking a pose" here too, right?

Naruto is 10c. Luffy is 40x before stacking Gear 2nd.

bruh it doesnt correlate stop trying to connect what isn't there, yes that is gear 2. but luffy has never combined gear 2 on gear 5?

Naruto is 28C or something upwards.

 

[KingTempest]

See that where you are wrong am not gonna discount this like it don't matter so unfortunately something like this will never happen in this fight as Naruto would be fully focused with thousand of clones.

 

[Trihexa102]

You're not illiterate.
You just choose not to read.
Luffy had regular kenbun. It was growing to future sight, but it did not reach full on future sight until later.
The Luffy who got hit by Flambe was the Luffy who was growing to future sight.

Gomu Gomu no Balloon.

That answers it all.

I am not gonna keep repeating myself on that topic man, luffy's future sight has drawbacks.

Gomu gomu no ballon only works on characters with far less AOE compared to Naruto.

 

[Kachon123]

bruh it doesnt correlate stop trying to connect what isn't there, yes that is gear 2. but luffy has never combined gear 2 on gear 5?

There is a direct correlation. Luffy strikes that pose to pump his blood in order to enter Gear 2nd.

That's exactly what he's doing here

 

[KingTempest]

I am not gonna keep repeating myself on that topic man, luffy's future sight has drawbacks.

And your examples are when he wasn't using future sight.
Fun.

Gomu gomu no ballon only works on characters with far less AOE compared to Naruto.

Based on nothing at all.

 

[Kachon123]

Naruto is 28C or something upwards.

Naruto is not 28c. His reactions are 28c. Luffy can consistently blitz 35c characters.

 

[Trihexa102]

what is this supposed to prove man? she isolated them cause kaguya has the greatest range in the verse, something luffy cannot replicate?

 

[DaReaperMan]

what is this supposed to prove man? she isolated them cause kaguya has the greatest range in the verse, something luffy cannot replicate?

If Naruto had proper future sight, he would not be caught off guard by something like that.

 

[Trihexa102]

Naruto is not 28c. His reactions are 28c. Luffy can consistently blitz 35c characters.

regardless you get my point, he can't just outright speedblitz naruto.

 

[KingTempest]

what is this supposed to prove man? she isolated them cause kaguya has the greatest range in the verse, something luffy cannot replicate?

This was Kaguya turning a mountain range into a bunch of attackable ice.

Luffy's rubberization range is the entire damn continent of Elbaph. Thousands of Kilometers. Naruto does not have AoE the size of the Continental United States.

LUFFY TURNED THE CONTINENT OF ELBAPH INTO HIS PLAYGROUND.

You choose not to read.

 

[Trihexa102]

If Naruto had proper future sight, he would not be caught off guard by something like that.

Nah i doubt he would, the scale of this attacks are greater than anything we have seen from anyone Luffy has ever fought?

 

[Trihexa102]

And your examples are when he wasn't using future sight.
Fun.

Based on nothing at all.

you know what i mean i can't keep repeating myself man.

 

[Kachon123]

If Naruto had proper future sight, he would not be caught off guard by something like that.

Mind you, even basic Observation Haki is stated to defend against that exact thing

 

[Robo432343]

I am not gonna keep repeating myself on that topic man, luffy's future sight has drawbacks.

Gomu gomu no ballon only works on characters with far less AOE compared to Naruto.

 

[KingTempest]

After fighting for 13 hours.

 

[Kachon123]

regardless you get my point, he can't just outright speedblitz naruto.

No. I do not get your point. People with 35c reactions get blitzed by Luffy so why wouldn't someone with 28c reactions?

 

[Trihexa102]

This was Kaguya turning a mountain range into a bunch of attackable ice.

LUFFY TURNED THE CONTINENT OF ELBAPH INTO HIS PLAYGROUND.

You choose not to read.

Bruh elbalph is not a continent i mean it might be much bigger than a regular island or country.

Kaguya's are ice world body which is already far greater in scale.

 

[Kachon123]

Bruh elbalph is not a continent i mean it might be much bigger than a regular island or country.

Elbaph is over 4000 kilometers.

 

[Trihexa102]

No. I do not get your point. People with 35c reactions get blitzed by Luffy so why wouldn't someone with 28c reactions?

when did luffy blitz kizaru? i don't recall that unless you mean his giant form, here which beats the point.

 

[Raiden38]

However, I don't understand why the discussion continues even though the grace period has passed...
This versus reminds me a bit of Makima vs Gojo in some ways...