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The Sun God Nika vs The Six Paths Sage (Luffy vs Naruto).

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KingTempest said:
This is regarding whenever they clash and enter that mental space where they talk about each other's emotions
Click to expand...
Entering the mental space for extended periods of time is once again an extreme case. This is shown by when A and bee fist bump, they don’t enter a mind scape but can read each others minds just as well.
KingTempest said:
This happened with fist bumps bro
Click to expand...
By folks with six paths level of chakra control, a kage level fighter and perfect Jin. All of them are not the norm
KingTempest said:
Genuinely the same thing
Click to expand...
😼
 
Chakra already includes mental/spiritual energy that comes from the mind. That covers things like
will, intent, and emotions, which fall under Yin.
That’s why in the series you see characters get stronger or push out more chakra based on their resolve or emotional state (like the Will of Fire, rage amps, etc.). It’s not separate from the system it’s already built into how chakra works.

So I don’t really get the argument that Haki is some special “will-based energy” when chakra already operates on that same principle Chakra just covers all and more that's all.. In Naruto chakra also makes it possible to manipulate your very own will Black Zetsu is the manifestation of Kaguya’s will, created through advanced chakra manipulation (Yin–Yang Release), where mental/spiritual aspects are given form.




We clearly see that emotions play a role in chakra as well, which shows that chakra contains all aspects of mental/spiritual energy, not just experience or thought. It includes will, emotions, intent, and overall mental state.

Emotion is what you feel
Will is what you choose to do with it

Will isn’t a separate energy type, it’s a component of mental/spiritual energy, and it can show up in different forms like conscious intent, emotional drive, inherited beliefs (like the Will of Fire), or even instinct.
  • Emotion = state (anger, fear, love)
  • Will = direction (intent, resolve,)
  • Haki = manifestation/output of that will








https://imgur.com/a/HtqZQ39

https://imgur.com/a/9PZmm9x

https://imgur.com/a/juZdh7O

imgur.com

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Chakra being connected to life force/physical energy (isshiki seeing his remaining life force as chakra)

https://imgur.com/a/I3onyOl

Nature energy/chakra the very energy in the world and Naruto can sense it.
 
Last edited:
Trihexa102 said:
lmao it allowed him hear conversations, increased his range and made it seem like he could hear your thoughts.
Click to expand...
Enel's allowed him to increase his range throughout skypiea.
This is what it was.
Trihexa102 said:
you guys need to add context to this man, cause i was like since when can luffy just hear peoples thoughts with Haki. if he could do this all along then most of the plot of OP would be settled.
Click to expand...
You made a point regarding enel when the person we used showcasing haki was Satori, not Enel.
Satori showed the mind reading feat, not enel.
Satori has no devil fruit.

So yeah, you're digging for nothing
 
AlternativePrinciple said:
Entering the mental space for extended periods of time is once again an extreme case. This is shown by when A and bee fist bump, they don’t enter a mind scape but can read each others minds just as well.
Click to expand...
Then you gotta give em telepathy for that then, this isn't a brain sensing feat
AlternativePrinciple said:
By folks with six paths level of chakra control, a kage level fighter and perfect Jin. All of them are not the norm
Click to expand...
This happened with Kid Naruto and Sasuke
AlternativePrinciple said:
😼
Click to expand...
 
Trihexa102 said:
That is pretty vague though voice as in his presence or him being heard.
regardless this is not mind reading.
Click to expand...
It's 4 am where i'm at and i've sent you scan upon scan upon scan of mind reading and you choose to deny each time.

I have shown you enough. You not wanting to believe it is not my problem.

It's accepted on the website, it's stated in the canon, it's stated in the side canon.
 
KingTempest said:
Enel's allowed him to increase his range throughout skypiea.
This is what it was.

You made a point regarding enel when the person we used showcasing haki was Satori, not Enel.
Satori showed the mind reading feat, not enel.
Satori has no devil fruit.

So yeah, you're digging for nothing
Click to expand...
The scan telepathy is accepted for on the wiki is from enel though? which like i said doesn't even help luffy anymore after reading the context.
 
Samlex1234 said:
Chakra already includes mental/spiritual energy that comes from the mind. That covers things like
will, intent, and emotions, which fall under Yin.
That’s why in the series you see characters get stronger or push out more chakra based on their resolve or emotional state (like the Will of Fire, rage amps, etc.). It’s not separate from the system it’s already built into how chakra works.

So I don’t really get the argument that Haki is some special “will-based energy” when chakra already operates on that same principle Chakra just covers all and more that's all.. In Naruto chakra also makes it possible to manipulate your very own will Black Zetsu is the manifestation of Kaguya’s will, created through advanced chakra manipulation (Yin–Yang Release), where mental/spiritual aspects are given form.




We clearly see that emotions play a role in chakra as well, which shows that chakra contains all aspects of mental/spiritual energy, not just experience or thought. It includes will, emotions, intent, and overall mental state.

Emotion is what you feel
Will is what you choose to do with it

Will isn’t a separate energy type, it’s a component of mental/spiritual energy, and it can show up in different forms like conscious intent, emotional drive, inherited beliefs (like the Will of Fire), or even instinct.
  • Emotion = state (anger, fear, love)
  • Will = direction (intent, resolve,)
  • Haki = manifestation/output of that will








https://imgur.com/a/HtqZQ39

https://imgur.com/a/9PZmm9x

https://imgur.com/a/juZdh7O

Chakra being connected to life force/physical energy (isshiki seeing his remaining life force as chakra)

https://imgur.com/a/I3onyOl

Nature energy/chakra the very energy in the world and Naruto can sense it.
Click to expand...

chakra is literally the better version of haki
they are definitely similar enough to be equalized
Furthermore, attacks that require a special type of energy to be effective, like anti-magic requiring magic, will be assumed to work against the energies of different Verses, as long as they are somehow similar and the mechanics are somehow compatible with the known mechanics behind the energies from different Verses.
Click to expand...
 
Trihexa102 said:
yea about GOD talking about enel's power to hear everything in skypiea, which we get context about?
Click to expand...
Incorrect, again.
It is talking about the power that Enel and his soldiers use, blatantly the soldiers since Sanji's asking and he hadn't met Enel yet, and they blatantly say "they" referring to the organization of enel's haki users as a unit and not just enel
 
KingTempest said:
Incorrect, again.
It is talking about the power that Enel and his soldiers use, blatantly the soldiers since Sanji's asking and he hadn't met Enel yet, and they blatantly say "they" referring to the organization of enel's haki users as a unit and not just enel
Click to expand...
bruh it's talking about mantra which is what enel uses to hear everything in skypiea, you are just saying what i said but differently.
 
Trihexa102 said:
bruh it's talking about mantra which is what enel uses to hear everything in skypiea, you are just saying what i said but differently.
Click to expand...
Mantra is what the priests and enel use. It is also what the little girl Aisa uses.
Mantra is nothing but another name for Kenbunshoku Haki.
Please read the series bruh.
 
there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that chakra and haki are somehow similar enough to be equalized
op voters dont want Luffy getting TSO'd coz of that
 
Robo432343 said:
there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that chakra and haki are somehow similar enough to be equalized
op voters dont want Luffy getting TSO'd coz of that
Click to expand...
Can you focus on something else for once? Damn

We stopped talking about that hours ago, you're the only one still worried about it
 
Robo432343 said:
chakra is literally the better version of haki
they are definitely similar enough to be equalized
Click to expand...
They aren't similar at all, we already been through this... Chakra does not allow you to shoot out your spirit to overwhelm other spirits, chakra does not allow you to sense others presence, Chakra does not allow you to manifest an armor

Chakra creates new energies... Which is nothing like haki
 
KingTempest said:
Can you focus on something else for once? Damn

We stopped talking about that hours ago, you're the only one still worried about it
Click to expand...
no bro??? you guys are the one whose worried about Luffy getting TSO'd...thats the entire reason why yall will refuse to admit verse equalization holds here
 
Robo432343 said:
no bro??? you guys are the one whose worried about Luffy getting TSO'd...thats the entire reason why yall will refuse to admit verse equalization holds here
Click to expand...
We're talking about something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT and you butt in just to say "oh man! you're worried about tso" like go away

you aren't even contributing to the conversation you're like a broken doll that says the same thing when nobody asks

You aren't even replying to old messages you're just saying the same shit over and over and over
 
KingTempest said:
It's 4 am where i'm at and i've sent you scan upon scan upon scan of mind reading and you choose to deny each time.

I have shown you enough. You not wanting to believe it is not my problem.

It's accepted on the website, it's stated in the canon, it's stated in the side canon.
Click to expand...
KT, you may need some sleep.
 
Mantra is what they use am not disputing that and it's another abstract form of obs Haki, it's not one-to-one with How it's used by other OP characters.
besides like i said the premise of mind reading stemmed from what enel could do with it but it's false with context.
 
Trihexa102 said:
Mantra is what they use am not disputing that and it's another abstract form of obs Haki, it's not one-to-one with How it's used by other OP characters.
besides like i said the premise of mind reading stemmed from what enel could do with it but it's false with context.
Click to expand...
Yo i swear you aren't reading.

The premise of mind control stemmed from Satori reading their minds.
It was explained as mind reading.
Enel was just another showing.
The telepathy link on the haki page links to chapter 257, which shows the explanation of haki for all the characters using it on the island. It was noted as the ability that
A. The vassals
B. Enel
C. Aisa
D. Everyone else who used it
Has

Mantra is not another form of observation haki. It is observation haki. They just call it mantra cause they're in another part of the world.

They all read the voices of people and they work from there.
 
Robo432343 said:
chakra is literally the better version of haki
they are definitely similar enough to be equalized
Click to expand...
Exactly chakra is just that dude… and I mean literally, to the point that even devil fruits abilities can be attained through chakra types/nature combinations and unlike in One piece they don't have any limitations/weaknesses like water etc…

Paramecia- types
Akimichi - size expansion

Logia types
Suigetsu - Hydrification Technique
Ryu(Boruto)

Zoan-like

Tailed beast and their jinjurikin..
Kabuto
Kisame
Orochimaru
 
KingTempest said:
Yo i swear you aren't reading.

The premise of mind control stemmed from Satori reading their minds.
It was explained as mind reading.
Enel was just another showing.
The telepathy link on the haki page links to chapter 257, which shows the explanation of haki for all the characters using it on the island. It was noted as the ability that
A. The vassals
B. Enel
C. Aisa
D. Everyone else who used it
Has

Mantra is not another form of observation haki. It is observation haki. They just call it mantra cause they're in another part of the world.

They all read the voices of people and they work from there.
Click to expand...
Again i said the link for telepathy comes from enel? not satori.

which is were am getting the scaling baseline used for telepathy on the wiki.

I know they use mantra man, I am saying their uses of it is different and more specialized than other OP characters especially Enel with context.

Now maybe satori could qualify(since he isn't amping it with his devil fruit) but i haven't seen anything remotely close to actual mind reading in Op thus far, it's a broken ability that can break a story/narrative.
 
MonkeyOfLife said:
They aren't similar at all, we already been through this... Chakra does not allow you to shoot out your spirit to overwhelm other spirits, chakra does not allow you to sense others presence, Chakra does not allow you to manifest an armor

Chakra creates new energies... Which is nothing like haki
Click to expand...
This is irrelevant because the verse = page just asks us if they have similar energy systems and if they can interact reasonably in combat...not if they have the exact same damn abilities.

"Chakra does not allow you to sense other presence." Straight up not true. Chakra allows individuals to sense the presence of others. That's a specific skill used by Sensor Type shinobi's and powerful individuals can also detect it anyway.

"Chakra does not allow you manifest an armour." Again not true. Chakra is defensively used as armour all the time like Chakra cloaks and Susanoo

"Chakra does not allow you to shoot out your spirit to overwhelm other spirits." No, similar effects to this still exist like killing intent and powerful chakra overwhelming weaker individuals

"Chakra creates new energies🥺" Okay? That's does not disqualify verse equalisation

Chakra covers sensing, defence, and spiritual stuff in in different ways so the differences you listed don’t disqualify equalization at all.
 
Trihexa102 said:
i can't imagine those from page 1 lol.
Click to expand...
IMG-2820.jpg
 
Trihexa102 said:
Again i said the link for telepathy comes from enel? not satori.

which is were am getting the scaling baseline used for telepathy on the wiki.
Click to expand...
the link for telepathy on the site links to chapter 257.
enel does not use telepathy on this chapter.
Trihexa102 said:
I know they use mantra man, I am saying their uses of it is different and more specialized than other OP characters especially Enel with context.
Click to expand...
it is not different at all. it was just fully explained so it doesn't need to say "we're reading minds" every chapter
Trihexa102 said:
Now maybe satori could qualify but i haven't seen anything remotely close to actual mind reading in Op thus far, it's a broken ability that can break a story/narrative.
Click to expand...
1. Rayleigh says that it's the same ability
2. The databooks say it's the same ability

It doesn't break the story or the narrative because most ppl who fight kenbun users are other kenbun users
 
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