Jujutsu Kaisen Discussion Page #1

[Rodriiogo]

Probably just ends up with us ignoring it and acting like PS is just very fast movement

How we are ignoring whole consistency (bc the current one sucks), feats, narrative and logic arguments over TWO-THREE statements is beyond me icl

 

[Arkenis]

How we are ignoring whole consistency (bc the current one sucks), feats, narrative and logic arguments over TWO-THREE statements is beyond me icl

I never said ignore consistency. Just that we'd ignore an ability's clear description to satisfy powerscaling. And statements, within context, help paint the narrative more than anything. We can drop all the calcs we want, but if the story isn't portraying the cast as lightning timers or hypersonic jets, that's simply harder to ignore.

And I'm not exactly saying everyone should scale below superhuman, but most characters realistically just aren't above supersonic or really subsonic. Anything past Mach 3 is obviously fair game on scaling within reason. Special grades, end of series jujutsu high and past sorcerers basically.

And idk why you call it two-three statements, if your argument is there's a limited amount of statements, there's ZERO statements for anyone being mhs to mhs+ range besides Gojo saying he could hit BF's 1 microsecond at will. There's not a single statement that anyone is Mach 5, Mach 10, etc. No one's got an ability where they accelerate beyond Supersonic, the main speedsters are verbatim stated their max speed is surpassing subsonic.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

I will make the CRT this weekend. No need to waste energy rn. Discuss it there

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

I never said ignore consistency. Just that we'd ignore an ability's clear description to satisfy powerscaling. And statements, within context, help paint the narrative more than anything. We can drop all the calcs we want, but if the story isn't portraying the cast as lightning timers or hypersonic jets, that's simply harder to ignore.

And I'm not exactly saying everyone should scale below superhuman, but most characters realistically just aren't above supersonic or really subsonic. Anything past Mach 3 is obviously fair game on scaling within reason. Special grades, end of series jujutsu high and past sorcerers basically.

And idk why you call it two-three statements, if your argument is there's a limited amount of statements, there's ZERO statements for anyone being mhs to mhs+ range besides Gojo saying he could hit BF's 1 microsecond at will. There's not a single statement that anyone is Mach 5, Mach 10, etc. No one's got an ability where they accelerate beyond Supersonic, the main speedsters are verbatim stated their max speed is surpassing subsonic.

Naoya isn't the main speedster.
Naobito was. He got no cap but whatever

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

Beginning of series Yuji > Entire verse in speed other than gojo, sukuna, naoya and naobito 🗣

Megumi considers Yuji in chapter 1 fast and doesn't even bother trying to catch him. Pretty much everyone grade 1 and below are around the same speed off chain scaling with Megumi. Everyone not special grade is at 16 m/s fr fr

JJK Season 3 Episode 1 Feats

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here

Just gonna say, using a sandbox probably would've been better considering there's straight up just a calc not done lol

Also did something similar for it with the manga distances a while back but got 19 m instead of 17 cause I used Choso who was at the 4th cone

 

[Giannysmag]

Deadass, this was never addressed lol
Do we just assume that everytime that that Naoya and Naobito blitz someone it's an outlier? I mean, 14m/s would make them slower than No CE Itadori. Ignoring that it's basically a 24x multiplier just contradicts the fundamental mechanics of Projection Sorcery

Even if I don't agree with the full removal of the cap an official discussion/CRT is not completly worthless

Is it actually a 24x multiplier tho? Like there have been so many interpretations of what PS does and it all sounds like headcannon.

What I've thought of since the first season 3 trailer came out is that Naoya and Naobito need to think of 24 frames of movement and when they move they kinda just teleport from one frame to other, which is why they both look like they appear and disappear when they move

 

[Giannysmag]

 

[BeTheWay1rst]

It's the first no biased Gojo VS Dabura I have seen

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

It's the first no biased Gojo VS Dabura I have seen

Mr. "High diffs raga" over gojo in strength (Meguna's now a dabura victim too)

 

[Mommyleona]

How we are ignoring whole consistency (bc the current one sucks), feats, narrative and logic arguments over TWO-THREE statements is beyond me icl

the verse is consistently subsonic-supersonic not higher lol
also what hecking narrative

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

How we are ignoring whole consistency (bc the current one sucks), feats, narrative and logic arguments over TWO-THREE statements is beyond me icl

Mate, Subsonic-Supersonic is constent and i say this as a guy thinks they can be faster

 

[Mommyleona]

I want consistency, so either nerf everyone to 16 m/s via Yuji's statement

Beginning of series Yuji > Entire verse in speed other than gojo, sukuna, naoya and naobito 🗣

JJK Speed CRT 2025

2f Sukuna calc deletion It was agreed here that the Supersonic+ calc currently in use should be removed. Replacement for it will be explained below. Replacement: Kenjaku speed calc This calc gets Kenjaku to Supersonic+ (Reaction Speed) and will basically work as the replacement to the calc...

vsbattles.com

 

[Rodriiogo]

the verse is consistently subsonic-supersonic not higher lol

Mate, Subsonic-Supersonic is constent and i say this as a guy thinks they can be faster

I dare to show any consistency for subsonic-supersonic being a cap (as thats what I was talking about, the cap makes no sense) other than the 2-3 naoya statements

also what hecking narrative

The whole argument that was just hapenning was about PS Naoya being that slow as a cap would make most of the verse slower than BoS Yuji "consistently", thats a narrative, the narrative is very much saying PS gives a 24 times over advantage over his normal self because instead of doing one movement like he normally does, hes doing 24 at once, this IS a narrative statement since its explaining how Naoya does what he does. Also if u wanna be iffy and count feats as narrative theres also that (im not doing that tho just to be fair)

 

[Arkenis]

 

[Rodriiogo]

I'd just wait for the crt as life of king said, we're gonna have superhuman jjk speed cap atp to be consistent

 

[Mommyleona]

I dare to show any consistency for subsonic-supersonic being a cap (as thats what I was talking about, the cap makes no sense) other than the 2-3 naoya statements

its where the verse consistently scales, and its those speeds that are consistently said to be fast, you're acting like 2-3 Naoya statements is not more than enough already

The whole argument that was just hapenning was about PS Naoya being that slow as a cap would make most of the verse slower than BoS Yuji "consistently", thats a narrative, the narrative is very much saying PS gives a 24 times over advantage over his normal self because instead of doing one movement like he normally does, hes doing 24 at once, this IS a narrative statement since its explaining how Naoya does what he does. Also if u wanna be iffy and count feats as narrative theres also that (im not doing that tho just to be fair)

you said that narrative supports the idea of higher scaling opposing the statements, when in reality it doesnt, the narrative supports the statements

 

[Rodriiogo]

its where the verse consistently scales, and its those speeds that are consistently said to be fast, you're acting like 2-3 Naoya statements is not more than enough already

I'd be fine with the cap if there wasn't constant feats exceed the cap, but there are.

you said that narrative supports the idea of higher scaling opposing the statements, when in reality it doesnt, the narrative supports the statements

Where and when exactly does the narrative support that cap??? There’s essentially nothing backing it, I’m not gonna deny that subsonic to supersonic feats exist, they obviously do, the problem is that there are also significantly higher feats that get rejected purely because they contradict the cap.

The defense for the cap being consistent via the feats is very much circular reasoning, like “the narrative supports the cap because it shows feats at that level”, while, at the same time, ignoring other narrative contradictions (PS) and feats because they don’t fit the cap. The cap is being used to justify itself, how is this logical?

Also I already pointed out stuff like kashimo's lighting, but I could also point out how Nue also uses lightning attacks, how Mechamaru uses JETS to boost himself during boost on, how Hanyu's CT is literally turning her own hair into a jet plane so she can ram herself and people through buildings.

 

[Lilybitdun]

Spoilers for EP1 of S3 ig
What even happened here lmao, did Yuta like blitz the curse to the point we don't even see him get up there? He was basically on ground level in a building far away from the apartment just a while ago.

Yuji tanking that curse's fall fragmenting that much ground seems like a decent durability feat ngl

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

These three Subsonic calcs have been recenty accepted.
More Subsonic consistency, we love those

 

[ElJoaki5]

JJK Season 3 Episode 1 Feats

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here

PB speed is probably inaccurate. Im gonna be making my own calc on it

 

[Rodriiogo]

PB speed is probably inaccurate. Im gonna be making my own calc on it

Is it because of the timeframe?

 

[ElJoaki5]

Is it because of the timeframe?

Ye

 

[Rodriiogo]

Ye

Is the supersonic calc for Naoya fine tho? (Cause that'd be a upgrade )

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

These three Subsonic calcs have been recenty accepted.
More Subsonic consistency, we love those

Do we currently accept the 120% Shibuya amp boosting speed and the 200% ISBODK boosting speed on top of that?
Because, if so, Jogo vs. Mahito got even funnier cuz ISBODK Mahito can likely dodge Jogo's maximum meteor

 

[Rodriiogo]

Do we currently accept the 120% Shibuya amp boosting speed and the 200% ISBODK boosting speed on top of that?
Because, if so, Jogo vs. Mahito got even funnier cuz ISBODK Mahito can likely dodge Jogo's maximum meteor

Not sure about the domain boosts, but the 200% mahito boost is just for his durability/strength:
"Mahito's naked/exposed soul where they are 200% stronger than before (in comparison). Furthermore, through a "Binding Vow" where they "cannot transfigure oneself (other than blades)", their strength increases dramatically!"

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Not sure about the domain boosts, but the 200% mahito boost is just for his durability/strength:
"Mahito's naked/exposed soul where they are 200% stronger than before (in comparison). Furthermore, through a "Binding Vow" where they "cannot transfigure oneself (other than blades)", their strength increases dramatically!"

looks like Bumhito blitzed by the supersonic meteor, fine by me
Jogat burns through that fraud's CE reseverse

 

[Mommyleona]

Where and when exactly does the narrative support that cap??? There’s essentially nothing backing it

literally everything in the narrative supports that the verse simply isnt that fast, narrator statements are narrative

they obviously do, the problem is that there are also significantly higher feats that get rejected purely because they contradict the cap.

like??
the hakari lightning bs or what?

Also I already pointed out stuff like kashimo's lighting, but I could also point out how Nue also uses lightning attacks, how Mechamaru uses JETS to boost himself during boost on, how Hanyu's CT is literally turning her own hair into a jet plane so she can ram herself and people through buildings.

and allat is insignificant in comparison to the statements, kashimo's lightning doesnt support shit, it's portrayed as unavoidable, Nue's "lightning" aint even actual lightning, and i dont understand how the last 2 matter

 

[Rodriiogo]

looks like Bumhito blitzed by the supersonic meteor, fine by me
Jogat burns through that fraud's CE reseverse

So we're acting like Panda and Kukusabe didn't dodge it

 

[Mommyleona]

200% ISBODK boosting speed on top of that?

isnt it just durability

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

So we're acting like Panda and Kukusabe didn't dodge it

Panda is a good point but Kusakabe can tussle with special grades and block Mahito uzamaki's without simple domain, ofc the goat dodged

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

isnt it just durability

no, it boost dura and strength.

「ま ひとだたましい すがた げんけいパーセント とうしゃ ひきょうど真人の剥き出しの魂の姿。 原形の200% (当社比)の強度。さらへんけいいがいしばきょうど更に 「変形しない (ブレード以外)」 という“縛り”で強度をばくあ爆上げしている!!」"Mahito's naked/exposed soul where they are 200% stronger than before (in comparison). Furthermore, through a "Binding Vow" where they "cannot transfigure oneself (other than blades)", their strength increases dramatically!"

 

[Buraqibear]

Mr. "High diffs raga" over gojo in strength (Meguna's now a dabura victim too)

Mr. High Diffs Raga is no diffing him so far btw. Performing better than 15F Sukuna ever did.

I'd be fine with the cap if there wasn't constant feats exceed the cap, but there are.

Dawg...I get where you're coming but but argue about this if the anime ignores or changes the statement, and even then you'd probably need another direct statement for Gege supporting the anime to get it accepted. These 2-3 statements are directly from the narrator in the manga and the author had a clear thought process while making the verse's scaling. There are like, two whole feats that apply to non Gojo/Sukuna/Takaba characters that exceed mach 3. There are no other feats that get higher, there's that one Maki Nue feat but that's only like two-three mach higher.

it's portrayed as unavoidable, Nue's "lightning" aint even actual lightning, and i dont understand how the last 2 matter

Kashimo's lightning is unavoidable because it homes in on the target, not just because of it's speed. And Nue's lightning matches enough properties of actual lightning to get it's speed

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Mr. High Diffs Raga is no diffing him so far btw. Performing better than 15F Sukuna ever did

No diffing? bro's lying. better than a playing around 15F Sukuna? sure, give him that

 

[Buraqibear]

JJK Season 3 Episode 1 Feats

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here

You could probably also calc the crater that giant curse made on the rooftop by calc'ing how big it's hand was because it was pretty big and seemed to have pulverized the stuff

 

[Rodriiogo]

literally everything in the narrative supports that the verse simply isnt that fast, narrator statements are narrative

Like what man, there's actual 0 supporting proof here you just said "everything does" what

like??
the hakari lightning bs or what?

Even ignoring hakari's feat with lightning (which is kinda dubious I will admit), Toji dodges lightning and Maki blocks lighting from Nue so like...? And even ignoring those high tier feats, the anime has a random curse from kenjaku already do a feat above mach 4, there's other anime feats that'd get high but get ignored because we all know why

and allat is insignificant in comparison to the statements

so we nitpicking which statement is significant, fairs

kashimo's lightning doesnt support shit, it's portrayed as unavoidable

It's unavoidable because Kashimo inserts positive energy into his opponents so the negative energy of his lightning gets attracted by it, not because of speed. Kashimo is basically giving his lightning homing properties (which is something he wouldn't need if the verse was that much slower but I digress, I guess gege just wanted to make an already 427x faster than the "speed cap" be homing for no reason )

Nue's "lightning" aint even actual lightning

Except it literally is but ok?

 

[Buraqibear]

No diffing? bro's lying. better than a playing around 15F Sukuna? sure, give him that

So we gonna ignore how 15F Sukuna's arm shattered from a direct hit?

 

[Buraqibear]

So we're acting like Panda and Kukusabe didn't dodge it

I believe one of Panda's cores got destroyed, that's why he was in his Gorilla mode afterwards for the entire arc

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

Even ignoring hakari's feat with lightning (which is kinda dubious I will admit), Toji dodges lightning and Maki blocks lighting from Nue so like...?

Brother, Anime Toji didn't dodge the lightning. He turned his head as lightning was coming at him and viewed it kinda slow

 

[ElJoaki5]

Except it literally is but ok?

No proof of it being lightning. It has never been stated to be lightning lets be deadass.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Kashimo's lightning is unavoidable because it homes in on the target, not just because of it's speed

Every lightning does that realistically