Nasuverse Discussion Board (New Forum)

[Elesia011]

When the new cosmo comes out, y’all ain’t ready for my H1A base, no amps, no limbs CCC Gilgamesh

Dies to a teenager

 

[Maniaunavailable]

Dies to a teenager

How old is BB again

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Tsukihime?, is that remake version or original?, the remake completely turned original into nonexistent iirc

The original still exists in its own timeline, and it's still canon, as shown with Melty Blood Type Lumina.

 

[Vietthai96]

The original still exists in its own timeline, and it's still canon, as shown with Melty Blood Type Lumina.

Oke, if i'm not wrong FGO still using original Arcueid. Though that said, no one plan to make Tsukihime Remake profiles?, i heard somewhere Remake characters is stronger than original

 

[Apotheosis69]

WOD do be one tapping nasu

You mean All verses… unironically

 

[Maniaunavailable]

You mean All verses… unironically

HP and the new JJTW scale are on the same lvl. SCP too but it’s SCP. All tier 0 verses so they can’t beat other tiers 0

 

[Maniaunavailable]

Oke, if i'm not wrong FGO still using original Arcueid. Though that said, no one plan to make Tsukihime Remake profiles?, i heard somewhere Remake characters is stronger than original

We are merging them together iirc. Tsukihime had a lot of relevant feats for the cosmo (main way they got 1A root iirc)

 

[Apotheosis69]

HP and the new JJTW scale are on the same lvl. SCP too but it’s SCP. All tier 0 verses so they can’t beat other tiers 0

HP is Masssively outdated. JttW though, oh boi you're in for a Treat

 

[Vietthai96]

We are merging them together iirc. Tsukihime had a lot of relevant feats for the cosmo (main way they got 1A root iirc)

merging profiles or just merging statements for cosmology? i'm heavily against the former

 

[Maniaunavailable]

merging profiles or just merging statements for cosmology? i'm heavily against the former

I honestly have no clue, I suggested having profiles for OG and Remake, but they just say “we are going to merge them”. You can ask in the nasu quality control thread if you want

 

[Maniaunavailable]

HP is Masssively outdated. JttW though, oh boi you're in for a Treat

HP still at tier 0, they are seeing who’s the tier 0 tho.

 

[Fezzih_007]

We are merging them together iirc.

No, we are not.

Why would we?

 

[Maniaunavailable]

No, we are not.

Why would we?

got misinformed, mb

 

[Apotheosis69]

HP still at tier 0, they are seeing who’s the tier 0 tho.

Okay. Thats for Tier 0. But even then all other Tiered characters are a completely different story.

And again suuper outdated

 

[Maniaunavailable]

Okay. Thats for Tier 0. But even then all other Tiered characters are a completely different story.

And again suuper outdated

All of the like 4 gods are beign reworked for H1A plus in base (they have higher forms but they are part of yog). So half of the verse is H1A plus in verse (cthulu has like 2 trillion smurf haxes). HP and WoD are tied for top 3 in fiction (ignoring SCP cuz its lame)

Edit SCP in a nasu convo is crazy

 

[Apotheosis69]

Is there a link for that, like sandboxes/blogs?

 

[Wesker018]

All of the like 4 gods are beign reworked for H1A plus in base (they have higher forms but they are part of yog). So half of the verse is H1A plus in verse (cthulu has like 2 trillion smurf haxes). HP and WoD are tied for top 3 in fiction (ignoring SCP cuz its lame)

how can they be in top 3 when tier 0 is the highest tier

 

[Maniaunavailable]

how can they be in top 3 when tier 0 is the highest tier

The ultimate gods serve as the pillars of the cosmology, so they are part of the arctype.

 

[Maniaunavailable]

Is there a link for that, like sandboxes/blogs?

Same case as JJTW, they say they are working on it (JJTW is beign gased a lot tho)

 

[Wesker018]

no, what i meant is, WoD and HP both have tier 0, so how are there two verses above them xd. That would mean those verses scale above tier 0

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Oke, if i'm not wrong FGO still using original Arcueid.

Eh, she's probably more like her Remake self, or both combined into one.

Though that said, no one plan to make Tsukihime Remake profiles?,

We're planning that. I think @ShinMaximillion or @CRIMPSUMPSKI2 are the ones doing that?

i heard somewhere Remake characters is stronger than original

Eh, not exactly. The original characters will probably scale to the new ones (and vice versa) since the Neco-Arc we see in Melty Blood Type Lumina is the same as the original Neco-Arc, the next free DLC for Melty Blood Type Lumina was supposed to be Len from the original timeline which would start a storyline where it would be the new timeline vs the old timeline (if they ever get around to making that...), and the original timeline characters still scale to Servants (kind of) and Shiki Ryougi, who are still the same today and have even fought the Remake characters (Saber/Altria Pendragon, Edmond Dantes, and Ushiwakamaru all are characters in Melty Blood Type Lumina).

 

[Apotheosis69]

Its why Tier 0 should never be included in how powerful Versus are. Because they beyond power and comparisons... it just makes it disingenuous

 

[Fezzih_007]

Is there a link for that, like sandboxes/blogs?

Yes.

got misinformed, mb

No prob.

 

[Apotheosis69]

Yes.

Could you link?

 

[Fezzih_007]

Could you link?

Here

Is not finished tho.

 

[Maniaunavailable]

Here

Is not finished tho.

is there any way I could help with tsukire?

 

[ShinyMagicalGirl]

So first Mecha Eli MK. II was a MechaGodzilla reference

Now King Eliza is a King Ghidorah reference!

King Ghidorah vs King Eliza when

 

[LilyNakahara]

Don't worry, that is why the High 1-A stuffs is just still a project, you can't simply bridge to higher scalings if the previous rating is not solid enough to sustain the next.

Avalon being 1-A is the backup plan if INS 1-A is somehow consistently disproven.

I will try to strengthen the INS thing with some more scans into a sandbox for now

It would be of great help if potential antifeats could be highlighted out for me to see to which extend I can negate them.

I can definitely point out some anti feats for example Imaginary Numbers is actually stated to have time, distance, co ordinates etc multiple times

Gyazo

gyazo.com

Which is why I'm unsure about 1A INS and 1A Avalon seems more possible to me so if you want to focus on INS, You can but I would suggest strengthening a 1A Avalon scale more

 

[Elesia011]

I can definitely point out some anti feats for example Imaginary Numbers is actually stated to have time, distance, co ordinates etc multiple times

Gyazo

gyazo.com

Which is why I'm unsure about 1A INS and 1A Avalon seems more possible to me so if you want to focus on INS, You can but I would suggest strengthening a 1A Avalon scale more

Your two scans, when read together, bury the anti-feat claim alive.
The Paper Moon description is explicit: Imaginary Space is a realm where direction, distance, and time randomly shift or rather, cannot be defined with every step. The “or rather” is not flavor; it’s the writer overriding the simile with the literal mechanism. “Cannot be defined” means no metric exists natively and not “it’s wobbly,” not “it’s random but measurable,” but undefined. Paper Moon doesn’t stabilize a pre-existing chaos. It imposes a coordinate system from scratch, using an “Unbreakable needle” that functions as proof of existence in a domain that otherwise offers no coherent reference frame. Calling it an essential measuring tool seals the deal: you only need an essential tool when the thing you’re measuring doesn’t exist without it. Native INS has no scale, no axis, no duration. The compass creates a temporary euclidean bubble inside a non-euclidean void.

Now bring in the second scan with Rin:
“The far side of the moon is a world made of imaginary numbers. There’s a concept of time here, but the way it works is different from the real thing.”
This is not a statement that time exists identically in INS. It’s a contrast. She says “there’s a concept of time” not “time flows,” not “clocks work,” but a concept, in other words an abstract stand-in that behaves differently from real-world time. This aligns perfectly with Paper Moon: inside the dive bubble, you get a simulacrum of time (a functional analog for navigation), but it is not the same as real-number time. It’s a fictional overlay a “concept” grafted onto a space that natively lacks it. Rin is speaking from inside the Paper Moon frame, where the imposed metric gives the illusion of familiar physics. Step outside that frame destroy the compass, lose the anchor and the “concept” collapses back into undefined.

Your anti feats is actually a double confirmation from two official sources that Imaginary Numbers Space operates outside standard dimensionality

Also note that what they experience in INS using the paper moon like depths is stated to be an illusion

 

[LilyNakahara]

Your two scans, when read together, bury the anti-feat claim alive.
The Paper Moon description is explicit: Imaginary Space is a realm where direction, distance, and time randomly shift or rather, cannot be defined with every step. The “or rather” is not flavor; it’s the writer overriding the simile with the literal mechanism. “Cannot be defined” means no metric exists natively and not “it’s wobbly,” not “it’s random but measurable,” but undefined. Paper Moon doesn’t stabilize a pre-existing chaos. It imposes a coordinate system from scratch, using an “Unbreakable needle” that functions as proof of existence in a domain that otherwise offers no coherent reference frame. Calling it an essential measuring tool seals the deal: you only need an essential tool when the thing you’re measuring doesn’t exist without it. Native INS has no scale, no axis, no duration. The compass creates a temporary euclidean bubble inside a non-euclidean void.

Now bring in the second scan with Rin:
“The far side of the moon is a world made of imaginary numbers. There’s a concept of time here, but the way it works is different from the real thing.”
This is not a statement that time exists identically in INS. It’s a contrast. She says “there’s a concept of time” not “time flows,” not “clocks work,” but a concept, in other words an abstract stand-in that behaves differently from real-world time. This aligns perfectly with Paper Moon: inside the dive bubble, you get a simulacrum of time (a functional analog for navigation), but it is not the same as real-number time. It’s a fictional overlay a “concept” grafted onto a space that natively lacks it. Rin is speaking from inside the Paper Moon frame, where the imposed metric gives the illusion of familiar physics. Step outside that frame destroy the compass, lose the anchor and the “concept” collapses back into undefined.

Your anti feats is actually a double confirmation from two official sources that Imaginary Numbers Space operates outside standard dimensionality

Also note that what they experience in INS using the paper moon like depths is stated to be an illusion

Ig you're right



So...are you gonna wait for the cosmology page...?

(I've talked with Toxic and they think INS is L1A so your interpretation isn't very different)

Btw Toxic is not getting unbanned before this year so no one knows when the page will come

 

[Vietthai96]

yeah no, they are literally existing, cannot be defined or measured =/= being nonexistent

 

[LilyNakahara]

yeah no, they are literally existing, cannot be defined or measured =/= being nonexistent

I was wondering the same thing

However it does say the things they feel is an illusion tho so idk

 

[Elesia011]

Ig you're right



So...are you gonna wait for the cosmology page...?

(I've talked with Toxic and they think INS is L1A so your interpretation isn't very different)

Btw Toxic is not getting unbanned before this year so no one knows when the page will come

Yeah I already said worst comes to worst it can't be less than low 1-A, though that would literally crush reduce by a layer whatever I am cooking

yeah no, they are literally existing, cannot be defined or measured =/= being nonexistent

“Cannot be defined” in a spatial/temporal context doesn’t mean “it’s there but hard to measure.”
It means there is no consistent mathematical structure (no topology, no metric tensor, no coordinate chart) that real-number physics can apply to it.
That’s exactly what pushes a space into 1-A:
it’s not just bigger, not just infinite, not just uncountable. It’s qualitatively beyond any real-number description.

I was wondering the same thing

However it does say the things they feel is an illusion tho so idk

We are running in circles, because at the very end any sens of dimension and time in the INS was clarified to be an illusion in the imaginary scramble event

 

[LilyNakahara]

Yeah I already said worst comes to worst it can't be less than low 1-A, though that would literally crush reduce by a layer whatever I am cooking

“Cannot be defined” in a spatial/temporal context doesn’t mean “it’s there but hard to measure.”
It means there is no consistent mathematical structure (no topology, no metric tensor, no coordinate chart) that real-number physics can apply to it.
That’s exactly what pushes a space into 1-A:
it’s not just bigger, not just infinite, not just uncountable. It’s qualitatively beyond any real-number description.

We are running in circles, because at the very end any sens of dimension and time in the INS was clarified to be an illusion in the imaginary scramble event

Now that I think about it

Isn't normal characters accessing INS an anti feat

Iirc according to the tiering Non 1A character can not interact with a 1A structure or character without a higher source of power smthn along those lines

 

[Maniaunavailable]

INS should be low 1A, but what about BB that can use it freely

 

[Elesia011]

Now that I think about it

Isn't normal characters accessing INS an anti feat

Iirc according to the tiering Non 1A character can not interact with a 1A structure or character without a higher source of power smthn along those lines

Which characters can normally interact with the INS without facing total annihilation?

Additionally, literally magic as a whole is not a power that originates from lower dimensions, and the same is true for the concept of mysteries. However, I will address all of that in due time depending how one may phrase their interactions as anti-feats.

 

[Elesia011]

INS should be low 1A, but what about BB that can use it freely

She will directly scale to that at least with CCC

 

[LilyNakahara]

Which characters can normally interact with the INS without facing total annihilation?

Additionally, literally magic as a whole is not a power that originates from lower dimensions, and the same is true for the concept of mysteries. However, I will address all of that in due time depending how one may phrase their interactions as anti-feats.

Well I gave all the supposed anti feats I could think of and you seem to believe they can be negated so I suggest you make a CRT if you actually believe your arguement is accurate

It's way better to try than to not try otherwise the idea will just stay in your mind and the conversation will lead to nowhere (cuz what's the point anyway if you don't try to revise the scale you think can be revised)



Hands over cooking licence

 

[Elesia011]

Well I gave all the supposed anti feats I could think of and you seem to believe they can be negated so I suggest you make a CRT if you actually believe your arguement is accurate

It's way better to try than to not try otherwise the idea will just stay in your mind and the conversation will lead to nowhere (cuz what's the point anyway if you don't try to revise the scale you think can be revised)



Hands over cooking licence

The main reason I was holding back is that I wasn't entirely clear on the state of the verse. Furthermore, I wanted to consult with other knowledgeable members first. I was hoping they could share their input and point out any potential flaws. This would allow me to either refine my points for a eventual CRT or be proven wrong, as I believe we should work as a unified block rather than separately to speed things up.

Currently, I'm taking a bit more time to thoroughly re-scan extra CCC material for any potential anti-feats, while also gathering additional scans to preemptively address future questions about my conclusions.

 

[LilyNakahara]

The main reason I was holding back is that I wasn't entirely clear on the state of the verse. Furthermore, I wanted to consult with other knowledgeable members first. I was hoping they could share their input and point out any potential flaws. This would allow me to either refine my points for a eventual CRT or be proven wrong, as I believe we should work as a unified block rather than separately to speed things up.

Currently, I'm taking a bit more time to thoroughly re-scan extra CCC material for any potential anti-feats, while also gathering additional scans to preemptively address future questions about my conclusions.

The main reason I was holding back



Yeah you should consult other knowledgeable members to be more sure (there's also Mages Association discord server if you haven't you should join it)

Currently, I'm taking a bit more time to thoroughly re-scan extra CCC material for any potential anti-feats, while also gathering additional scans to preemptively address future questions about my conclusions.

Good luck