DEATH BATTLE! Discussion Thread (All-time Death Battle Spoilers Alert)

[FuarRu23]

No, that was actually me combining two thoughts and failing to express it better. My bad.

He resists Transmutation from other means, the MV bypasses his resistance and we know isn't simply because of the MV infecting him because it's a "virus", and that's why the MV is layered.

And what are the showings or proof of him resisting transmutation? Also, you just say the same argument of metal virus being layered because of Shadow diseases immunity, which I already said is a bad argument

 

[ShakeResounding]

To be fair, Wonder Bowser does have 2 Layers for his Transmutation

When the layers to the verse are proposed in a CRT, the Metal Virus ends the arc with 3.

 

[ZeNoviceArtist]

he knows he's dead just making a megamind ref

Actually () it's a Despicable Me ref.

 

[ShakeResounding]

Also, you just say the same argument of metal virus being layered because of Shadow diseases immunity, which I already said is a bad argument

You just quoted my post saying I expressed my arguments poorly and that it was my fault kek, don't make a strawman

 

[Tipper17]

Actually () it's a Despicable Me ref.

Lol my bad

 

[ZeNoviceArtist]

Lovers of salt tend to be made of salt.

I like salt, it makes food taste better.

 

[JoshDoshMosh]

 

[Dust_Collector]

Mind giving me the TLDR for why this statement doesn't work? I'll admit that my knowledge of TP is spotty due to cobwebs, but it doesn't seem too bad from a glance.

The veil of Twilight he uses for this doesn't seem to merge the worlds in literal sense going by visuals, just kinda links them together spatially, but for the most part the statement doesn't work because of the timeframe it all takes for the merge, after a few days the twilight still hadn't even expanded to the clouds above Hyrule, whereas a decent number of Zelda fans take the statement to mean it's basically an instant merge of the entire universe with the twilight realm.

Plus, y'know, more than likely an outlier. The latest game even has a dude empowered by the Triforce of Power (Which is >>>>> something that one shots Zant with just a fraction of it's power) and he can't perform a tier 2 feat without getting the full Triforce.

 

[FuarRu23]

You just quoted my post saying I expressed my arguments poorly and that it was my fault kek, don't make a strawman

I see that you ignored my question of me asking for proof or examples of Shadow resisting transmutation and decided to focus on me saying that you're basically saying the same argument in your second sentence

 

[ZeNoviceArtist]

I genuinely believe that after AmoGuys, KratoSura will be next.

 

[Starsprite53]

Idk but Bullying Infinite is based as **** and deserved, I hate how he is getting overhyped by some people, I love also the Metal Sonic SWEEP during the fight

 

[FuarRu23]

When the layers to the verse are proposed in a CRT, the Metal Virus ends the arc with 3.

And what was the reasoning behind that notion?

 

[TartaChocholate]

The arguments that bullets should make you question characters stats its ridiculous, you expect them to bounce off their skull or body like superman?

At the end of the day if your characters shouldnt worry of a gun blasting their brain, why would you as the audience worry, it limits things in a story

That's not what I meant, dude. What I'm saying is that if we want to disregard this or that high end because the existence of common anti-feats it shouldn't be specific to certain verses, and rather a general rule or standard if we want to apply it at all. All verses have anti-feats somewhere, so one verse being inconsistent is not that heavy of a claim to begin with. Having worked on Final Fantasy myself for a while, we do accept their better more formidable showings, but missiles and city wide destructions are hardly the lowest ends the cast have displayed and bullets is not the only small time danger there, there's other common stuff like danger of being crushed by rubble, blown up by regular bombs, dying in a crash or from a falling vehicle, have this super fast character require a vehicle for transportation, falling from a great height, being unable to force open a locked door, etc, but we don't let that get in the way (though I did have to make an entire blog post explaining why firearms in FFVII are more powerful than real life ones to try to dress the "it's gameplay mechanics" argument).

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

I see that you ignored my question of me asking for proof or examples of Shadow resisting transmutation and decided to focus on me saying that you're basically saying the same argument in your second sentence

The most explicit example I found on Shadow is resisting the effects of Team Chaotix's team attack, which normally turns enemies into rings.



His profile also says he can resist the effects of the Magenta, Ivory, and Blue Whisps, but it doesn't link Shadow resisting those things so take that for what you will.

 

[JJSliderman]

Idk but Bullying Infinite is based as **** and deserved, I hate how he is getting overhyped by some people

Genuinely don’t know where this is from, at best I’ve seen people say he counters boos cuz he makes light, not cuz he’s some hypebeast solo machine

 

[TartaChocholate]

But there ain't no anti-feats in Zelda baybee

Uh... yes! If anyone brings up dangers of collapsing castles, they are totally lying!

 

[JJSliderman]

His profile also says he can resist the effects of the Magenta, Ivory, and Blue Whisps, but it doesn't link Shadow resisting those things so take that for what you will.

It’s from Team Sonic racing, he can get hit by the blue wisp directly. You can hash out if blue wisp has the same powers as blue wispon though, since that’s the one with transmutation.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

It’s from Team Sonic racing, he can get hit by the blue wisp directly. You can hash out if blue wisp has the same powers as blue wispon though, since that’s the one with transmutation.

So that's where it comes from...thanks for telling me where it originates from.

Just wish there were links which showed them resisting those Whisps, though.

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

Honestly, I do see the reasoning on using anti-feats to keep an average of sorts, but only Mario seems to be applying it. Everyone else just goes for high ends. If the same standards were applied everywhere, most big tier verses would be knocked several numbers down.

The only reason this doesn't happens is because no one cares for collecting anti-feats, rather, as yourself said, caring only for the highest-ends. The anti-feat list for Mario is VERY big, and how many of these are previously discussed prior to the Tier 6 Downgrade? I'm more inclined to agree with Cosmic Mario than i was in the past but you can get my point

We should honestly start applying this to every single verse on a way that they get a Tier that makes logical sense to their showed limits and feats. If FFVII, Kirby, SMT, Sonic or whatever has more logical anti-feats than feats, then they should be downgraded accordingly

Conclusion: I'm not juding you but rather giving my view point on this subject :V

(though I did have to make an entire blog post explaining why firearms in FFVII are more powerful than real life ones to try to dress the "it's gameplay mechanics" argument).

Might link it?

Your blogs on FF are very good and have great explanations btw, good job

 

[JoshDoshMosh]

 

[Chronicplane]

I'm from the future, and I can confirm this be legit.
But nah fr, decided to take some inspiration from the board of wizdom returning an used it for guaranteed future MU's to create prediction for what they'll do and based on community versus setting.
Red is Shigaraki and Mahito da purple.
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/927136690752061460/1308115329284702228/Board_of_Wizdom_Mahiraki_Template_Filled_Complete.png?ex=673cc4d6&is=673b7356&hm=7ddb2aee0612e5be49e8f027b3eb60294b62839e5bd800be451c3bb767b972ac&

 

[Dust_Collector]

Uh... yes! If anyone brings up dangers of collapsing castles, they are totally lying!

Yeah that's true, Minish Cap and Ocarina of Time in particular never had anything like that

 

[JJSliderman]

So that's where it comes from...thanks for telling me where it originates from.

Just wish there were links which showed them resisting those Whisps, though.

Admittedly it could be seen as shaky, racers can throw the blue wisp as a projectile and survive hitting it

 

[Darkmon_cns]

In FF they get threatened by friggin bullets. The whole inconsistency and anti-feat issue exists pretty much everywhere, but Mario seems to get a really hard filtering because of them. But if you squint hard enough, you will find plethora of anti-feats in other heavy hitter verses like Sonic, Persona, Devil May Cry, etc.

Honestly, I do see the reasoning on using anti-feats to keep an average of sorts, but only Mario seems to be applying it. Everyone else just goes for high ends. If the same standards were applied everywhere, most big tier verses would be knocked several numbers down.

Franchises with stuff like a super sonic tend to avoid this better, sense only base forms absorb the anti feats

 

[TartaChocholate]

The only reason this doesn't happens is because no one cares for collecting anti-feats, rather, as yourself said, caring only for the highest-ends. The anti-feat list for Mario is VERY big, and how many of these are previously discussed prior to the Tier 6 Downgrade? I'm more inclined to agree with Cosmic Mario than i was in the past but you can get my point

Yeah, and I agree. And, well, it's understandable in a way. When you're essentially gauging how strong a character is you essentially want to see how far they can go and all, it's actually rather admirable when people actually play fair and bring up both the good and the bad (like Zelda does in here, tbh).

We should honestly start applying this to every single verse on a way that they get a Tier that makes logical sense to their showed limits and feats. If FFVII, Kirby, SMT, Sonic or whatever has more logical anti-feats than feats, then they should be downgraded accordingly

Conclusion: I'm not juding you but rather giving my view point on this subject :V

No, no. Don't worry. I understood you pretty well in that regard. And in many ways I agree on this as well. Just that I think, knowing full well that actually implementing it would be hard, that it should be a standard for everybody if it were to be used. If all verses had to take responsibility for their anti-feats and that would inevitably lead to downgrades, then well, it's what it is. I'd be lying I wouldn't be bummed to see the FF ratings go down, but it's kinda like when Acausality 4 got nerfed, I'm part of the bunch that agreed that it was too strong of an ability and too easily attained, so it's downgrade led to some big nerfs on FFVII, but I thought it was fair.

Might link it?

Your blogs on FF are very good and have great explanations btw, good job

Ah, thanks dude. Just me being obsessive over an oldie.

Here it is. Long story short: the same company that manufactures weaponry also is the one behind bioengineered super soldiers, magic and war mechs, so it would be contradictory the firearms they produce, commercialize and give to their own troops, would be completely ineffectual.

 

[Issen_Mk_III]

Now that the novelty has worn off, I can pick apart some reasonings and not kill the vibe.

Here's the main things they got wrong in terms of HAX going by this site (I'm ignoring AP):

• Eggman and his forces can't answer transmutation
  • False: Chaos Energy protects against what is literally called Transmutation, from the Metal Virus. Not only is it layered, but Chaos Energy negates the effects and having all Emeralds intensifies the resistance effects.
• Sage's Cyber Cages/BFR to Cyber Space are countered by Dimensional Travel
  • False: Bowser's troops have no answer to Cyber Corruption that erupts after escaping the Cages, nor can they answer being forced into a state of virtual existence that forces you between two states of being.
• Phantom Ruby is only Illusions
  • False... Kinda: I don't think you can use simplistic illusions to burn The Resistance to a crisp, nor can an illusion trap you in a dimension cut off from all others. They are fake to Eggman and his posse but very, very real to Bowser.

The rest I think aren't important enough to mention. Gave Bowser the respect he deserved after the Ganon L, but I found Eggman lacking in representation. If Metal didn't have a go at it, Eggman would have looked absolutely washed.

They forgot that the Phantom Ruby's "illusions" collide just fine with better "real reality warping" in Egg Reverie Zone. They REALLY overestimated the potency & function of the Wonder Flower. The Phantom Ruby also has a sort of failsafe for when it interacts with reality warping, rips your power source out & creates a rift in space-time like it did with Phantom King.

 

[ZeNoviceArtist]

What's the etymology of Hyperversal and Outerversal?

 

[TartaChocholate]

Franchises with stuff like a super sonic tend to avoid this better, sense only base forms absorb the anti feats

Well, that's the good thing with super forms, they are actually protrayed as super. Though stuff does slip here and there ocassionally.

I'm from the future, and I can confirm this be legit.
But nah fr, decided to take some inspiration from the board of wizdom returning an used it for guaranteed future MU's to create prediction for what they'll do and based on community versus setting.
Red is Shigaraki and Mahito da purple.
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/927136690752061460/1308115329284702228/Board_of_Wizdom_Mahiraki_Template_Filled_Complete.png?ex=673cc4d6&is=673b7356&hm=7ddb2aee0612e5be49e8f027b3eb60294b62839e5bd800be451c3bb767b972ac&

It legits look great, good job! And yes I'm biased, despite only watching only season's 1 and 2 of MHE I'm still pissed at Mahito for the whole fiasco with Junpei, and especially about Nanami and Nobara.

 

[Issen_Mk_III]

The salt of the Sonic fans on this site is delicious, they deserved to get humbled, nobody actually believes in garbage like 7D, 6D or even just 5D Game Sonic, and I love how Bowser is the first character in Death Battle that actually overpowers and defeats a Sonic character Super Form instead of just outlasting it and finish them off once they are in base. Also lol at the person believing that the Jade Wisp is comparable to Boos, almost all wisps are featless fodders with barely any haxes

He didn't overpower a super form, Kamek swapped the emeralds to Sage (which can be resisted since the emeralds are sentient & appear to help who they want to).

 

[JJSliderman]

No he did. Think it’s a reference to Sonic getting blown out of his super form a few times in Frontiers and other games

 

[koopa3144]

He didn't overpower a super form, Kamek swapped the emeralds to Sage (which can be resisted since the emeralds are sentient & appear to help who they want to).

Kamek was already K.O'ed by Metal at that point and nothing implies Kamek swapped the emeralds to Sage.

 

[Issen_Mk_III]

I think due to the match being seen as more competitive in the discord due to there being actual Mario supporters, the episode will age better over there as there will be much more push back and debate, whereas I see the mask going off over here over time due to Mario supporters being wiped out by that meteor or something

New VSBW lore, Mario supporters went extinct because of a meteor strike and now we can only find cave paintings as proof they were ever here.

I love Mario...I just...have literally never played any of his RPGs & very few of his party games, so I only have surface level knowledge of scaling & haxes.

Where's The real cal howard when you need him? I remember him being one of THE Mario guys on here back in the day.

 

[Issen_Mk_III]

Kamek was already K.O'ed by Metal at that point and nothing implies Kamek swapped the emeralds to Sage.

I suppose you're right, but I would buy the Kamek hax more. Wishful thinking, I guess.

 

[Issen_Mk_III]

Kamek was already K.O'ed by Metal at that point and nothing implies Kamek swapped the emeralds to Sage.

Actually, the verdict implied this.

 

[XXBenShapiroXx]

I love Mario...I just...have literally never played any of his RPGs & very few of his party games, so I only have surface level knowledge of scaling & haxes.

Where's The real cal howard when you need him? I remember him being one of THE Mario guys on here back in the day.

All I know about Mario hax tbh was my inside guy in the death battle discord telling me there was a huge discussion on things like the pure hearts and wonder flower being way stronger than they get credit for before the episode.

I know jack shit about the power stars and shit, and I've been told not to trust this site for Mario hax, so I have no good source for Mario that isn't just being trickle fed shit from my informants.

The G1 blog was a good start tho

 

[koopa3144]

Actually, the verdict implied this.

That doesn't immediately mean it happens in animation especially when Kamek was very clearly taken out of the fight. Like @JJSliderman said, its prob a reference to times when Super Sonic is overpowered in Frontiers and loses the emeralds for a bit.

 

[Gyra1524]

1,215,527 views in slightly over 24 hours.

 

[XXBenShapiroXx]

On my like 10th fight rewatch. Still a phenomenal fight.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

he knows he's dead just making a megamind ref
also Eggman survived crazy shit before it wouldn't be shocking to see a route where he survived this

It's a Despicable Me reference.

 

[Tipper17]

It's a Despicable Me reference.

Yeah i got it mixed up

1,215,527 views in slightly over 24 hours.

Already doing better than OmniDock Gioker early viewing